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My buddy Ed wanted a black dial watch. Since we are not the sort that would be able to afford a thousands of dollars or tens of thousands of dollars watch. We thought to get some Musou paint and try to whack something out. I think it turned out pretty nice.

The movement is an ETA 6498-1 which is actually one of the movements commonly recommended for beginners to start with as it is relatively simple and relatively large. That being said if this is your very first attempt at watch mechanicing it would be wise to acquire a couple of junkers first to practice stripping down and rebuilding before you embark on this one if it has any value to you (monetary or sentimental) It sounds to me like the keyless works are out of sync. This could be relatively simple to sort out but involves uncasing the movement and removing the dial and hands so that you can get at the keyless works.

Just to start a thread on strap/bracelet selection as this is always something I struggle with - given that a good strap or bracelet can elevate the look of a watch and frame your hard work in the best light and, conversely, a poor choice can make your hard work look cheap and cheesy. I propose we use this thread to get the help of the forum.... more brains to help, how can we fail?! I suggest you post a picture of your finished watch and let the creative juices flow.... can be the naked watch if you don't have any idea or the watch with the optional bracelets/straps you want to pick from.

This caliber originally was unitas 6498 , later made by ETA and modified with etachron system. That it jumps and doesn't wind, winding gear slips out of engagement with winding wheel, possibly due worn windin gear or weak set lever spring, Dial plate needs to be removed so you can see the keyless, in case you couldn't spot on the fault, a video of it doing its number will reveal the fault in slow mo. You might want to post your vid on youtube and give us the link hear. Rgds

Nope I'm not biting, absolutely not

Have you been to Dr ? No problem, I help vivat ruin his watch.

It may just need the Etachron stud and regulator adjusting, which is shown in the Youtube I posted. I don't think that Vivat should start fiddling with the hairspring - of if he does his chance of trashing it must be very high.

Balance & cock assembly must be put back on the mainplate, cock screw tightened, then a close up of the coil from balance side view, is needed to check the coil for levelness. To adjust the coil for concentricity, you apparently ought to start at the terminal bend, the terminal curve itself needs a bit of work as it should be parrarel to all other coils .

He's next to the hen

I was afraid of the air brush, but since it was Ed's birthday so I thought why not just learn by doing. Now I am thinking of getting glow in the dark paint and air brushing dials to get that lume dial look.

Yah not bad. Movado-ey. They can’t afford an expensive watch because they maxed out on project toys, high end camera equipment and video editing tools… …all that and less than ten follows…

Adjustments to hairspring , terminal curve and regulator slot might be needed at every service time. Make a habbit of making these adjustments as soon as you get to bare mainplate, instal the balance cock assembly on mainplate. See photo, notice how accessable are most parts of the oscilator thus easy to work on.

Ahh i'm sorry, lot's of problems because I simply don't understand all the terms of watchmaking industry. (English is not my native language)

I prefer 9504 for the lubrication. I was going to mention that yesterday but conveniently the tech sheet I had didn't really show a clear image of that so I just let it slide. Then in some other discussion group there was a very heated argument between me and somebody else as to whether you do that at all. He had book evidence or at least mention the author who said you do not because you need friction. But everybody else in the group was agreeing with me that they use grease before putting the cannon pinion on.

Seattle used to be such a nice place but now the politicians have had their way and have destroyed the city. fortunately I'm only a couple of blocks from the northern border side barely have to drive into the city at all. Which is painfully slow by the way as they decided for safety reasons that the speed limit should be 25 almost everywhere in the city. so basically streets that used to be between 30 and 40 are now 25 and residential streets are even slower. But don't worry as all the police officers have left for variety reasons your chances of getting a speeding ticket are nonexistent.

Hi irina, not to repair it yourself, if you had that skill you would already know that answer. A professional restoration very likely more than the watch's value. I see your other options as finding another identical dial that fits to replace this one, striping and customising the dial you have as a fun project. What does this watch mean to you ?

Hi restoration would be the only answer or replacement, you may want to customise it yourself there are many transfers available on the net, being a cusion style dial how popular they are I don’t know.

So the next test would be to remove the hr, min and seconds hands and repeat the test you did before; If didn't slow down the oscilator, its the hand tubes that rub. if did , the fault is with the canon pinion and/ or minute gear, tight canon pinion ....etc. You already have the canon pinion mounted on center arbour, so it needs not to be broached, just add a bit of oil on center arbour and turn the crown, this will reduce friction there and if you remove/ clean the oil/ grease the center arbour your done. Stuttering seconds hand can be moved anti clock, but something must move it back, which takes us to faults said above.

Hi, unless you have a contact for a really, really talented restorer, that dial is beyond saving. If you happen to know the case reference and/or movement, we might be able to help track down a replacement dial that will fit that squircle case. There may be something on the back, but often Tissot put their reference details inside the caseback on those vintage timepieces.

Admittedly Mike thats far less insulting than what i had in mind

The second hand moving backwards when setting the time backwards is quite common. I'm not sure i would call it an issue. Just tried it on my 2 year old seiko 5 and the second hand stops while i set the time. The main reason i always set the time forwards.

Coins be hands fouling, also check the leaf spring correctly sitting on the back of the seconds pinion if it has one. This spring is there to stop the seconds hand 'stuttering'. Just need to pop the back off and look.

Have a look at this

Haller and Hof Meier made so many different movements it is probably imposable to get the proper replacement platform. I must say the one you are showing looks good the same colour brass as the movement and looks correct to the plate. When you have large pallet jewels that need replacing steel is normally the preferred replacement. If this was in my workshop. I would make a new steel fitting to hold the pallets

Haha- I’m upset I’m not offloading my project list because someone’s giddy about a new toy, not the latter. I just want everyone to be happy

Hairspring rubs on underside of the cock, the coil should be level , flat, and concentric. Rgds

There is a chart here that gives you the size according to case reference: https://www.esslinger.com/individual-breitling-case-opening-dies/

The reason the dial foot soldering machines work the way they do is it creates heat right at the joint, and for just a brief moment. Other methods of heating the parts to flow the solder will inevitably create too much residual heat, almost guaranteeing damage to the front of the dial.

That's the basic story as I learned it many years ago. There a good write-up on Tony's site about it. Seems Mr. Leinen worked for G. Boley, then left to make his own bench vice (which Boley made an exact copy of). He got the Boley name when he decided to start making lathes, in direct competition with G. Boley. Apparently this was a source of embarrassment for the family, and it seems later lathes are simply marked "Leinen". Mine has Leinen cast into the headstock, but the end of the bed is marked Boley & Leinen.

That’s what they would like but they didn’t count on Yorkshire men

Hi Waggy. The tool basically comprises of a transformer (mains) stepped down to 12v . The 12v is the business end. one clipped to the dial the other to the electrode and when they come together we get an arc. Not rocket science. I should trawl the site as I put the making on it. I am away from my main machine where all the details are for two weeks. Have a look ar Google they list plenty of commercial ones at silly prices and some DIY versions. Mine uses as its power source a car battery charger so no e lectrics involved and it has over current protection so no big bangs either.

Cool, I was thinking of having a go at something similar with Stuart Semples black 2.0 Tom

Hiya waggy, the liitle gadget i posted shouldn't produce sparks it uses a flame heat source. Transfers heat from various sized brass stumps down a length of copper ( eventually cut off to form the dial feet ) to the low heat melt solder paste . Solder paste containing bismuth has a melting point around 140° C . I cant say how strong this will be, i haven't tried it yet. Would you believe i still have an untouched syringe of it in my fridge ( it can go off pretty quick, even unopened ) if you are interested i can post some photos of the device and parts and i think there is an instruction leaflet with it. I was actually going to make a low voltage electrode one with WW's help but this thing popped up on Ebay at a very silly reasonable price even just to resell it as some nutters on Ebay have them up at nearly 500 GBPs. For 50 quid it wasn't worth me getting parts together and my head around making one i was very busy at the time. Still haven't tried it yet , but its Bergeon so it must be amazingly amazing. I liked the idea of a real heat source i could see, fire and me get on better than electric and me, like a house on fire in fact , ba-dam tishhhh.

If you're still purging after 24 hours or develop a fever, please go to a hospital. Meanwhile, keep hydrated and maintain your electrolytes. If we don't hear from you within 24 hours, someone please call the Yorkshire police

I hear you, now I only search for the manual if I hit problems or the movement looks especially unusual or tricky. This is in part because I am lazy and in part because often there is no manual out there and what you do find often amounts to little more than a parts list. There are exceptions of course, for instance Seiko have some pretty good documentation out there, but for that one-off eBay find you will be lucky indeed to find anything that comes close to a service manual. Fortunately, most movements follow a similar configuration so once you get a feel for it you can take an educated guess (even - eventually - for those oddball movements) at the correct procedure to disassemble/assemble and lubrication etc. and it normally works out, and if not we are here to help! If you are struggling, perhaps a better strategy I have had good success with, rather than searching endlessly for a manual, may be to search on YouTube as there is a reasonable chance that someone may have a video showing how they serviced the same, or similar, caliber watch, but you will have to use your own judgement to evaluate if they are worth listening to of course. There are some great YouTubers out there and some......erm.....not so great ones. However, even the bad ones may be worth watching as an example of what NOT to do I junked a lot of my first watches...maybe 10 or 15 all junked one after the other, then that first win! and slowly your ratio of winners and junkers starts to get better until the junkers become the exception. So be prepared for failure at first, but there is light at the end of the tunnel .... keep trying, just like one of the better YouTubers says "nobody is born a watchmaker".

I tried a few, but blue was close but not close enough and grey didn't work, so went with a steel bracelet in the end which seems to set it off nicely. I always struggle with strap selection, in a way they can make or break to look of the watch. But it's such subjective thing I guess there are no hard and fast rules to help. However, this is not what this thread is about so maybe worth starting a new thread to discuss? @AndyHull Great job on the Rotary by the way! I always have a soft spot for Rotary as it was the first watch I ever 'wanted', I remember it was a square black and gold one. Similarly Accurist which was the watch I bought with my first pay check and still have it. Here is the new thread:

Ok well I'm so confused now. We seem to have gone from a pallet stone that was dislodged ( or did i just imagine that ? was the lever replaced or just a very lucky first time refitting the stone ) to a poor tg reading to reasonable tg reading to a discovery of a new vertical position of a watch movement. I really dont know where to go with this Geez follow the path Rich, it takes you out of woods and into the forest

I've been to a lecture where it was explained why Rolex watches cost so much to service. In the service center where they have an endless supply of parts we don't have they do replace stuff. This would mean more than likely they must have supplemental information telling the center what they're supposed to be replacing and why. But we don't get that information ever. Oh and then what about old Rolex service information what is that go? So I asked a friend who used to run the service center and he said when Rolex would send out at least the days of the physical now it's all online where it can't be copied supposedly. But in the days of the physical when you received the new documentation you are required to send all of the old documentation back to Rolex. If you're seeking a technical guide the best place to look is eBay. There's a seller in Italy that seems to have a continuous supply of Rolex manuals. I've seen some other one stroll up on eBay in one particular case the seller was getting negative reviews because apparently the seller was photocopying some of the manual. Otherwise anything out there is only going to be bits and pieces or vintage stuff like the PDF I'm attaching. oh and a suspicion of why he don't see anything modern PDF if somebody had the modern manual why would they PDF it anyway. then I have a suspicion Rolex would be unhappy if you are distributing PDFs of their manuals. yes the old days where I service to watch for somebody and it came back with the reverser is not suitable. I'm sure if all the procedure my instructor told us in school but that didn't apparently work. Fortunately in those old days Omega parts were still available for material house I just purchased a brand-new one the problem was solved. Today you would look in the technical guide like the one I attached from Omega there is a procedure for the reverser wheels you don't even have to take them apart which you can't do anyway because you wouldn't have the tools and there's no reason to when you have a procedure that's better. the problem with reverser wheels each of the companies have differing procedures. Rolex has a procedure where lubrication has to be in specific places but definitely not in other places they have to use epilam and follow some procedure that they have in their manual. the phrase turn it away implies moneymaking job? The problem with a Rolex watch is if you make a mistake a can become a very expensive mistake. Plus the bonus of Rolex doesn't like any of us which means purchasing new components well go look on eBay and see what things cost. There are some aftermarket components for Rolex although Rolex frowns on that. The big thing the think about is if you taking jobs in for money you're doing it for the fun of that and you have an accident just how expensive is at accident going to be. Then you find out why typically the service people I think for Rolex watches don't know about this one was at the lecture was at least $600. And that's from a service center that would have all the parts Omega 8645_WI_40_rules for lubrication cousins UK.pdf 2130-2135-tech rolex technical notes update March 1987.pdf

Mostly they go in the bin. Occasionally if it is interesting, unusual or unused, then I may take the time to clean it and re-use it. I also tend to save interesting buckles and such like, to put on to fresh leather. I figure cleaning metalwork is a lot simpler and safer than trying to fumigate well worn old leather. Leather is pretty tough stuff though, so a little diluted bleach and a lot of scrubbing goes a long way. Rejuvenation with neetsfoot oil or leather rejuvenation products can work wonders.

Grey sounds like it should work, or how about a dark navy blue? My lunchtime fix for today. Not much to say, new crystal obviously, new battery, full fumigation and case clean and polish. The original Rotary strap was almost unworn, so it also got a fumigation and was re-used. .. and here is the Montine I did the other day for comparison. I'm spoilt for choice.

Okay, we're officially done! For now.. The 6309-7040 turned up, and there wasn't a lot worth rescuing on it. The case, crown, and casebook are in okay condition, but a lot of shallow tool marks on the caseback. The dial was aftermarket and the hands had barnacles on em. I bought a new crystal replacement kit and a period correct bezel, plus all required gaskets. I've shoehorned in the 6309 movement that I'd previously rebuilt along with a new dial and hands, plus waffle rubber strap. At the end of the day, not a lot of that original eBay watch made it into this, but there are some parts in there. This ended up costing an absolute mint, but I'd be lying if I said it wasn't worth it. The amplitude for this movement absolutely sucks (~190), most likely because I made a complete dogs breakfast of the mainspring install. I've been practising, and have some more 2892 mainsprings on the way, so I'll do another service and see if I can get the movement working better in the future. But for now... we're done.

Similar rules to which i employed when i started, if it revolves oil it, if it slides grease it. If its a small pivot use thin oil , if its an arbor use thick oil, anything inbetween use some viscosity inbetween ( much more to consider than this but its a start ). Practice and advice along the way will help you refine this very basic guideline. Lubrication is a huge subject that can cause controversy and getting it right as regards to accurate placement and correct amount makes a big difference in how the watch will perform, not just in the long run but effects can become apparent quickly if your oiling practice lacks precision.

So you mean that it's okey ?