Timex M25 date wheel

[Dave84]

Well, while on lock-down I woke up this morning with good intentions of oiling up an old Timex marlin i wear from time to time. After my recent success stripping and servicing a 6309a I figured that oiling the old "disposable" movement wouldn't be to tricky. I followed the service manual barring removal of the balance because I am still a little scared of going near hairsprings, put the dial back on and was bending the last dial foot back into place when my tool slipped and went right into the movement, snapping the pallet fork clean in half. I went from feeling pretty pleased with myself to devastated instantly.

I had a donor in my toolbox minus a balance assembly. Feeling like I had no choice I set about changing the balance over and spent about 45 mins fighting with the loose end of the hairspring and wedge pin which is like threading a needle with your eyes closed, at least for a total beginner like me. After a few hours I managed to get it fitted and running well.

 The only thing that's stumping me now for some reason is the date wheel of all things, it just doesn't seem to be holding into place with the assembly. After the day I have had it can sit on the bench until the morning . 

Any techniques out there that people use gratefully received ?

If nothing else it will give the more experienced a good old laugh during these sobering times.

Hope you are all safe and well

Thanks

Dave 

 

 

 

It had once belonged to my late grandfather but wasnt exactly an heirloom  as it came to me needing a set lever, a new stem and a strap.. I got it working last year and wear it 

[watchweasol]

Hi Dave  Which manual do you have. I have a timex 25 manual with exploded view if thats any help.  I have included it in the post,   cheers

25.pdf

[Dave84]

25 minutes ago, watchweasol said:

Hi Dave  Which manual do you have. I have a timex 25 manual with exploded view if thats any help.  I have included it in the post,   cheers

25.pdf 4.8 MB · 2 downloads

That's the one, I followed the description of reassembly but it just doesn't hold in place very well .

[watchweasol]

Hi Dave   Not too familiar with the 25 but usually there are locaters which guide the day/date wheels, either one or both are screwed to the plate,  Is yours floating, if so it mabe relies on the dial and its washer to apply the pressure to hold it down.

Hopefully our Timex Guru JerseyMo will pick up on this or alternativly PM him. Cheers

[Dave84]

So, as it turns out I was pretty tired last night after working on the watch for the better part of the day.

(Apologies for the random sentence at the bottom)

That being said I hope you can forgive me for putting the date wheel on in the wrong order ... 

I took a look at the service manual over breakfast and noticed straight away, ran through and fitted it without too much issue.

I got it put back together but the second hand seems a bit bent and is now catching on the minute hand now .. typical.  

Whenever I work on watches I always learn way more than I bargained for, like having to fit a new balance and feed the hairspring through the regulator slot and wedging into place.

Most of it is due to inexperience but I do enjoy the process, retrospectively ...

Cheers 

[Melt]

You should be able to carefully bend the second hand straight.

Patience and time (some of us have a lot of that at the moment)

Good luck. Stay safe.

[transporter]

2 hours ago, watchweasol said:

Hi Dave   Not too familiar with the 25 but usually there are locaters which guide the day/date wheels, either one or both are screwed to the plate,  Is yours floating, if so it mabe relies on the dial and its washer to apply the pressure to hold it down.

Hopefully our Timex Guru JerseyMo will pick up on this or alternativly PM him. Cheers

pretty sure yours is as watchweasol has said, they are a pain at times to stay in place, well done with the hairspring, i started on timex watches so i know your trepidation. straightening a hand is reasonably straightforward, again just take your time.

[watchweasol]

Well done Dave  some times you get a light bulb moment and you see things clearly, Obviousya breakfast moment,,,,     well done 

[azkid]

Before bending hands make sure the hour and minute hands are installed correctly. I seem to recall needing to adjust the angle of one of my timex minute hands not long ago. Although I think I also fiddled with the hands for a half hour and finally gave up and bent the second hand very slightly

[JerseyMo]

and no photo of the watch?

 

[Dave84]

Hi guys, just a quick update

The donor movement doesn't seem to be holding up, the pin on the 4th wheel that runs up through the the canon pinion seems far too short, like it has been snapped and there just isn't enough on the end to hold the second hand. 

Also, the balance regulator is pretty bent which is forcing the hairspring onto an angle. 

Is it at all possible to take the plates apart, that way I might be able to replace the pallet fork on the old movement and then swap the balance back across?

Failing that ill be looking for a replacement M25 movement. 

 

[JerseyMo]

4 hours ago, Dave84 said:

Is it at all possible to take the plates apart, that way I might be able to replace the pallet fork on the old movement and then swap the balance back across?

 

Yes, the plates are held together by three screws.

 

[Dave84]

8 minutes ago, JerseyMo said:

Yes, the plates are held together by three screws.

 

Thank you, Is it like a can of worms when you open it up or is it a pretty straight forward  job ?

[JerseyMo]

51 minutes ago, Dave84 said:

Thank you, Is it like a can of worms when you open it up or is it a pretty straight forward  job ?

well its like holding on to petroleum jelly. 

[Dave84]

3 minutes ago, JerseyMo said:

well its like holding on to petroleum jelly. 

Hahahahah great. Thinking about it, I could have a go at taking them apart because in their current states both movements I have are no good but if I manage to save the part I need I may be able to fix one, if not I will have to source another movement anyway 

[JerseyMo]

3 minutes ago, Dave84 said:

Hahahahah great. Thinking about it, I could have a go at taking them apart because in their current states both movements I have are no good but if I manage to save the part I need I may be able to fix one, if not I will have to source another movement anyway 

What is wrong with the original movement?

[Dave84]

1 minute ago, JerseyMo said:

What is wrong with the original movement?

I snapped the pallet fork with a rogue screwdriver as I was folding over the last dial tab ....

[JerseyMo]

8 minutes ago, Dave84 said:

I snapped the pallet fork with a rogue screwdriver as I was folding over the last dial tab ....

the pallet fork is the most fragile of all the parts.  You should be able to swap them.

 

[Dave84]

3 minutes ago, JerseyMo said:

the pallet fork is the most fragile of all the parts.  You should be able to swap them.

 

I was frustrated with myself, I am usually very careful. There is also a certain amount of guilt because the watch belonged to my grandfather, typical. 

I  will attempt it tomorrow , fingers crossed I don't break anything else ... 

[Dave84]

Well, there's no going back now.

I have taken both movements apart, removed the good pallet fork and sat it in place in the old movement.

I have offered up the dial side to clamp it back together several times now and have disturbed the wheels each time. I will keep trying but any tips  with lining it up will be very welcome :-)

[watchweasol]

I am afraid there is no magic wand with these movements just a great deal of care and patience. they are fiddly little things,    Like one of those puzzles where you have to get all the little balls in the holes. always one falls out.   best of luck.    cheers

[Dave84]

23 minutes ago, watchweasol said:

I am afraid there is no magic wand with these movements just a great deal of care and patience. they are fiddly little things,    Like one of those puzzles where you have to get all the little balls in the holes. always one falls out.   best of luck.    cheers

I am sat here wondering if I could make a lowering platform of sorts with grips top & bottom that could keep the movements on a straight trajectory with each other. Got to be better than my unsteady hands  

[JerseyMo]

have a look at this post - 

 

[Dave84]

9 minutes ago, JerseyMo said:

have a look at this post - 

 

Thanks Mo 

I will refer to this and rebuild the movement in the same fashion as yourself , perhaps I will have more luck .

[Dave84]

Got on with the Timex this afternoon, replaced the pallet fork and added some photos of the process.

The Mrs has called "food" so I will have to call it for now. 

I feel pretty happy that I was able to put it back together but a big thanks to Mo for linking the above feed, it really helped. The service manual doesn't go as far as taking the framework apart so it was uncharted territory for me. I just hope it works ...

The pallet fork isn't lined up with the balance yet, but that's the final task to see if it springs to life.