Understanding the mind of mainspring winders.

[Lotus]

Hey guys, I'd like to share a story about my personal experience with mainspring winders, and raise a few questions regarding ordering springs and winding arbors. I hope you enjoy my anecdotes regarding the art of winding a mainspring. If you want to get straight to the point you can skip the next 2 paragraphs...

So I did it, I got my first set of mainspring winders. It happened about 2(?) months ago. Up until that point, I had been ordering mainsprings for my respective calibers from CousinsUK. This was all and well, and admittedly I have not gotten very far in watchmaking yet. In fact, I had only ordered 2 mainsprings from Cousins. The first mainspring was measured out based on a version of the movement and measurements from my micrometer. It arrived naturally in the little red ring, so I put it on top of the barrel and pressed down (quite evenly I must say) with my probe stick. It went straight in without any problems It was almost all in perfectly save for the very end of the coiled up ring, which was standing neatly on top of barrel wall. I tried to manipulate it, and learned that night that a mainspring which is mostly coiled up except for a small part hanging with a path of no resistance will not work well for the calming and soft environment of the Watchmaker's Bench' natural state. So I took a little trip to my local watchmaker. They wound it back in (free of charge I might add, thank you local watchmaker!) and I went on to finish that restoration.

So along comes another watch. A watch with a broken mainspring. I ordered a mainspring from CousinsUK, this time with the exact specs provided from a lovely website which I will link at the bottom of the post. It arrived naturally in the little red ring, so I-well, I think you know where this is going. The same thing happened. And this time, I did not feel like wasting my local watchmakers time with my trivial requests. Truthfully, I even wanted a set of winders, and this gave me an excuse. So I got a set of Watch-Craft Bracelet Mainspring winders for a good price. Now this is where some other questions start to occur.

• The small winders are just small. I mean, what movement uses a 5mm barrel?
• Going back to my natural red ring, how do I prevent the mainspring from slipping when putting it into the barrel from the ring? Am I supposed to order a smaller size?
• When winding with my set of winders, I can really only wind a mainspring once before it seems the arbor made the spring end hole (thingy) too large to hook on to the winding pin. I am sure I'm using the right arbor size because the next size up does not fit and the size below slips. Why is it like this?

Also, man does someone need to start putting cheap 3d-printed sets on the market.

This is the lovely website I was talking about: https://www.emmywatch.com/db/

Anyways, sorry for the long post, hoping you don't hold it against me in your answers, and I hope you are able to answer. Thank you!

[HectorLooi]

I feel your pain. I have 5 sets of different winders and still have to wind a mainspring by hand once in awhile. 

I discovered this method where you can use the original mainspring arbor to wind the mainspring into your Watchcraft winder barrels. Please have a read of the post below. 

 

 

[Lotus]

1 hour ago, HectorLooi said:

 

 

 

Wow, that's a really good way to do it! Thank you, I will try it out!

[LittleWatchShop]

4 hours ago, Lotus said:

sorry for the long post

Yup...too many words.  Find a set of K&D winders on ebay.  If the arbor is not damaged, they will do fine...once you develop some skill

[Klassiker]

Pushing a new mainspring from its ring into the barrel should not present any problems if you have bought the correct spring. If the spring doesn't sit inside the barrel diameter with the ring sitting flat on the rim before you start pushing, then you will have the problem you describe.

[tomh207]

Have a look in the tools section of the forum, there is a 3d printed mainspring winder set designed by a member here and also sold on eBay by another member here.

here you go, worth a look and both folks involved are very helpful 

 

Tom

[nickelsilver]

Other than caliber specific winders, they are often a crap shoot whether they will work well or at all. And yes, there are watches with 5mm barrels, some very expensive ones too!

 

Sometimes the winding arbor is too large, sometimes too small. Sometimes the hook is too close to the winder cap for a given height of mainspring (not much you can do there), sometimes too far (just a bit of a pain usually, except super low profile springs). Sometimes the hook is too large to fit the hole in the spring. Some springs are so thin they want to slip into the area between the plunger and the winder barrel. It's always an adventure.

[VWatchie]

1 hour ago, nickelsilver said:

It's always an adventure.

Amen! 

[Neverenoughwatches]

6 hours ago, nickelsilver said:

Some springs are so thin they want to slip into the area between the plunger and the winder barrel. 

Yup I've had that one a couple of times, then spent a good half hour trying to free it. It resembled a slinky after the ordeal and the filler i used to patch up the wall that had a winder temporarily embedded in it is still visible. A light brush of oil around the inside rim of pusher works wonders.

5 hours ago, VWatchie said:

6 hours ago, nickelsilver said:

It's always an adventure.

Amen! 

There's an idea for a book.  " The Adventures of a Watchmaker " 

[Zero]

On 10/24/2023 at 9:49 PM, Lotus said:

Also, man does someone need to start putting cheap 3d-printed sets on the market.

Wish granted . 3D printed RS winder project and design files hosted on Github (link).

 

On 10/25/2023 at 12:31 PM, nickelsilver said:

Some springs are so thin they want to slip into the area between the plunger and the winder barrel. It's always an adventure.

It is really troublesome when this happens. The root cause is the stubborn tail of the mainspring. If it is thin enough, it will try to slip in between the plunger and the barrel wall.

This is why "tooth" was added to the plunger in the RS winder (see picture), preventing this issue from ever happening. Never had to deal with it again.

[Yxoc]

 I have been using the 3D printed winders designed by zero and I am coming to believe they are an excellent option. Even with less than optimally printed parts from my local library, I achieved success after some practice. I have not used traditional metal winders but my suspicion is that it would take a similar period of trial and error before becoming proficient in their use also.
 

I recently purchased two bases, from Andyshap who sells sets on eBay, as the bases with the small holes designed to accept the staple ‘hook’ is the most critical part from a printing accuracy standpoint. Andy’s parts are well printed (photo below), prices are reasonable, and he is a pleasure to deal with. The barrel, plunger and setting base that the library printed were easily good enough to work as designed.

 
The greatest difficulty I’m having with the 3D printed winder is the initial setting of the spring into the drum such that the tail of the unwound spring exits through the appropriate aperture. The wall on the 3D winder being so much thicker than the thin metal wall of a traditional winder makes this initial alignment more difficult. For the price, and ease of procurement (not having to trawl eBay waiting for a good vintage set to turn up) they are tough to beat!