Tweezer types

[Neverenoughwatches]

Hiya watch peeps, i thought about a light discussion on types of tweezer might make a recent change. So newbies listen up it will help to understand why parts ping away, we all ping parts from time to time, what did we do that had us spending 2 hours on our hands and knees ? What metal do we all prefer ? Different types of steels, brass, bronze, titanium, carbon fibre, ceramic tips, wooden tips. What sizes and shapes do we think is better for different tasks ? Which metal grips better, scratches less, has the least tension ? who shapes thiers ? Who polish thiers ? Its the most used and taken for grante hand tool, and the one that causes the most frustration, what can we do to lessen that ? Tips from the pros and long time experienced are most welcome

[tomh207]

My collection of tweezers are cheap, some Italian steel, the cousins titanium and bergeon carbon.  I keep the metal ones dressed and roughened the inside of the points by drawing them along some folded over 400 grit wet & dry. This seems to work out ok. The carbon fibre ones I find kinda clunky but use them for battery changes and handling dials/date rings.

i just picked up a couple of old dumont number 1s in a cheap job lot, one modified. I am looking forward to trying them once cleaned up and dressed. They feel so different compared to the modern ones, somehow they just feel right. I think I am getting an idea of why people seem to rave about the old dumont ones.

my experience compared to most here is at best fledgling but these are my thoughts so far.

 

Tom

[Nucejoe]

Welcome to this friendly pingers club. 

[oldhippy]

For main watch work dumont number 3, fine work dumont number 5. Those were my main ones I used. Always bought dumont. I had others for different types of work when it came to clocks. I even cut old pairs down for  mainspring work. 

[Neverenoughwatches]

47 minutes ago, tomh207 said:

My collection of tweezers are cheap, some Italian steel, the cousins titanium and bergeon carbon.  I keep the metal ones dressed and roughened the inside of the points by drawing them along some folded over 400 grit wet & dry. This seems to work out ok. The carbon fibre ones I find kinda clunky but use them for battery changes and handling dials/date rings.

i just picked up a couple of old dumont number 1s in a cheap job lot, one modified. I am looking forward to trying them once cleaned up and dressed. They feel so different compared to the modern ones, somehow they just feel right. I think I am getting an idea of why people seem to rave about the old dumont ones.

my experience compared to most here is at best fledgling but these are my thoughts so far.

 

Tom

progressive learners on the same path we is Tom, i have a dozen or so old Dumont tweezers that i just kept on collecting plus some bergeon, precista and few English makes. The dumonts do feel just right compared to the rest. Cousins titanium tweezers i think are fantastic for the price, for non scratching very comparable to brass but somewhat tougher. I also have two pair of the cheap cousins brass that arrive very poorly finished. Spending an hour or so shaping the tips and polishing the tips outsides an inch or so up of these makes a world of difference ( not a great idea to polish where you hold them even with finger cots on they become rather frictionless . For fine work these cheap brass are absolute garbage very soft so i changed the profile completely to compensate, one pair has thick narrow  tips the other wide long thin tips, around 3-4 mm width they are perfect for handling bridges, they have so much grip at that width. I use only 3 pair regularly, the  wide brass for plates, bridges and barrels, medium titanium for screws and moving jewels and shock springs around and a no.4 dumont with stiff square tips for pulling out keyless, click and calendar ring springs. Adding in a couple of others for hairspring manipulation and barrel disassembly. Feels like a good combination for the time being. Definitely roughen up the brass and titanium inside, the steel i feel not so much and we should always check the tip pinch to see if the end is opening  up ready to launch that unobtainable part to the far corner of space, just a light push on the backside of each blade on the bench usually closes it back up again. 

 

12 minutes ago, oldhippy said:

For main watch work dumont number 3, fine work dumont number 5. Those were my main ones I used. Always bought dumont. I had others for different types of work when it came to clocks. I even cut old pairs down for  mainspring work. 

More efficient sticking to using just a couple of pairs, nice to have a few bespoke homemade for specific jobs. 

39 minutes ago, Nucejoe said:

Welcome to this friendly pingers club. 

Haha not sure about that Joe, 2 days ago for the first time ever i had to get on hands and knees. Nearly two hours of clearing my bench, taking books off shelves, shaking my printer upside down, looking in every corner on hands and knees. The setting lever i had just solder repaired was called every name under the sun. Just about to give up after one final floor sweep with super magnet  " ahha you little bast--d found ya ". 

[Knebo]

These are my tweezers. 

The No3 and No5 from Dumont were my go-to tweezers for the longest time. Great quality (with the corresponding price). But then... 

I worked on a nice vintage Omega, I bought cheap No3 brass tweezers (CousinsUK own brand) to avoid scratches on the movement. It came in rather bad condition, with the tips not really meeting properly. I spent time dressing it with an India stone and sanding paper (which i fold once and rub it between the tips). After some effort, they were perfect. And I repeat this dressing process regularly. 

As a consequence, those cheap brass tweezers became my favourite ones. I basically use them for everything. I feel that brass grips things a bit better than steel (as if the softer material "molds" around the parts). 

The cheap Carbon tip ones, I primarily use to handle dials, hands and when I want to hold the entire movement. They also came with thr tips not meeting properly, but I sanded them to work ok. 

The Dumont No6 are only for hairspring work and indispensable for that, I think. 

I haven't got used to the rounded 7A brass tweezers yet, but maybe I will eventually use them.

Thr super thick AA tweezers are used rarely and only when I need to hold something really tight. 

I've included the plastic stick from Bergeon even though it's not tweezers. But it is so incredibly useful for many things. Holding down bridges before/while putting screws, holding down springs click/yoke spring while removing/inserting them with tweezers in the other hand, etc etc. 

My 5 cents for today... 

 

 

[JohnR725]

One of the problems we have with tweezers are manufacturing differences and even possibly how they function for a given number reference. In other words some tweezers will come together as point tips which is very undesirable for watch repair versus with the tips come together in a parallel fashion which is much better for grabbing and holding things.

Unfortunately as nice as my tweezers are in other words I use a number two practically indestructible almost. They seem the last forever the jaws come together nice in parallel to have a very nice feel their nonmagnetic and apparently they been discontinued. There's an article down below that explains and the article does not do justice on how these tweezers are made I suspect they been discontinued because it's a complicated process. You can't tell from the outside looking at them but if you look at the inside edge the handles are made out of stainless steel the tipster out of the titanium alloy. They been soldered together but it's done very very nicely.

https://fontax.ch/history-of-fontax-taxal/

 

 

[Neverenoughwatches]

1 hour ago, Knebo said:

These are my tweezers. 

The No3 and No5 from Dumont were my go-to tweezers for the longest time. Great quality (with the corresponding price). But then... 

I worked on a nice vintage Omega, I bought cheap No3 brass tweezers (CousinsUK own brand) to avoid scratches on the movement. It came in rather bad condition, with the tips not really meeting properly. I spent time dressing it with an India stone and sanding paper (which i fold once and rub it between the tips). After some effort, they were perfect. And I repeat this dressing process regularly. 

As a consequence, those cheap brass tweezers became my favourite ones. I basically use them for everything. I feel that brass grips things a bit better than steel (as if the softer material "molds" around the parts). 

The cheap Carbon tip ones, I primarily use to handle dials, hands and when I want to hold the entire movement. They also came with thr tips not meeting properly, but I sanded them to work ok. 

The Dumont No6 are only for hairspring work and indispensable for that, I think. 

I haven't got used to the rounded 7A brass tweezers yet, but maybe I will eventually use them.

Thr super thick AA tweezers are used rarely and only when I need to hold something really tight. 

I've included the plastic stick from Bergeon even though it's not tweezers. But it is so incredibly useful for many things. Holding down bridges before/while putting screws, holding down springs click/yoke spring while removing/inserting them with tweezers in the other hand, etc etc. 

My 5 cents for today... 

 

 

 

56 minutes ago, JohnR725 said:

air versus with the tips come together in a parallel fashion which is much better for grabbing and holding things.

Thats how i shaped the wide tip brass ones i use, they act like a pair of pliers gripping a larger surface area. 

1 hour ago, Knebo said:

These are my tweezers. 

The No3 and No5 from Dumont were my go-to tweezers for the longest time. Great quality (with the corresponding price). But then... 

I worked on a nice vintage Omega, I bought cheap No3 brass tweezers (CousinsUK own brand) to avoid scratches on the movement. It came in rather bad condition, with the tips not really meeting properly. I spent time dressing it with an India stone and sanding paper (which i fold once and rub it between the tips). After some effort, they were perfect. And I repeat this dressing process regularly. 

As a consequence, those cheap brass tweezers became my favourite ones. I basically use them for everything. I feel that brass grips things a bit better than steel (as if the softer material "molds" around the parts). 

The cheap Carbon tip ones, I primarily use to handle dials, hands and when I want to hold the entire movement. They also came with thr tips not meeting properly, but I sanded them to work ok. 

The Dumont No6 are only for hairspring work and indispensable for that, I think. 

I haven't got used to the rounded 7A brass tweezers yet, but maybe I will eventually use them.

Thr super thick AA tweezers are used rarely and only when I need to hold something really tight. 

I've included the plastic stick from Bergeon even though it's not tweezers. But it is so incredibly useful for many things. Holding down bridges before/while putting screws, holding down springs click/yoke spring while removing/inserting them with tweezers in the other hand, etc etc. 

My 5 cents for today... 

 

 

Using a pair of no. 7s is interesting, i quite like the hand position, feels more comfortable your wrist seems less bent unless you pick screws up by the threads. I very rarely use them though for some reason, i probably stabbed myself with an upturned pair, never to forgive. 

Edited December 17, 2023 by Neverenoughwatches

[gpraceman]

These are the tweezers that I use for most things.  The Italian brass tweezers I use most often.  The angle on them makes some things easier to do.  I did have to dress them a bit to get them to my liking.  The ceramic tipped tweezers I use for dials, date rings, hands, and other delicate items.  I do occasionally use them to open up case backs, by pushing on a notch.  They've held up to that abuse.  Vintage Dumont #'s 3 and 5 round things out.  I do have some cheap tweezers that I use on occasion when I don't want to risk damaging my good tweezers with a task.

Edited December 17, 2023 by gpraceman

[ColinC]

I remember feeling tempted to try and save money on tweezers - but now I feel that I would prefer to have 1 less £30 watch than  struggle with the wrong tool.

I have:

• Bergeon 7026-00 - big heavy things that came with a quick service kit I was given as a present when I started this hobby. Good for pressing canon pinions back in place
• Dumont Brass 1AM - These are my go to tweezers.  I have scratched bridges etc picking them up with the heavy Bergeon tweezers, this is much less likely with these nice brass tweezers.  Downside is that they need to be maintained and are not fine tipped enough open and close incabloc settings or manipulate hair springs
• Dumont, Dumostar #5. For picking up jewels, opening incabloc settings and as the main hand when manipulating hair springs
• Dumont, Dumoxel #6. For holding hairsprings while I stroke with the #5s and for getting things in awkward places the #5s can't reach
   

I am now looking at getting myself a set of cutting tweezers and would be interested in recommendations - the 2 cuts I currently want to make are to the hairspring and to the pin holding the hairspring in the stud.  The pin looks to be more substantial an I am wondering if all cutting tweezers are up to the task?

[Knebo]

4 minutes ago, ColinC said:

Dumont, Dumostar #5. For picking up jewels, opening incabloc settings and as the main hand when manipulating hair springs

This is interesting. I also use the No5 for Incabloc/shock settings and hairspring main hand.

And I used to use it for jewels, but found that my well-dressed (but still thicker) brass tweezers (No3) get a better grip on the jewels. They used to sometimes ping away with the No5 but with the brass tweezers I've not had that issue. But this may also just me developing better skills. And certainly, everyone can have their own preferences.

I've really become a fan of brass tweezers over time.

[ColinC]

1 hour ago, Knebo said:

They used to sometimes ping away with the No5

I asked my kids if they knew the game "Tiddlywinks" - they said no (iPhone generation).  But I am reminded of the game every time I take a cap jewel out of the chaton to clean it I know that unless I am very precise the slightest touch will send it flying (like a tiddlywink!).

I can get the cap jewel out of a jar of B-dip with the #5 tweezers and also find them better for holding the cap jewels steady while trying to get the right sized drop of oil into the middle of the jewel (failure leaves me with a jewel sucked onto my oiler).  But I think I might be better at turning the jewel over with the brass tweezers where my risk of sending flying is not insignificant!

Edited December 17, 2023 by ColinC

[Neverenoughwatches]

2 hours ago, gpraceman said:

These are the tweezers that I use for most things.  The Italian brass tweezers I use most often.  The angle on them makes some things easier to do.  I did have to dress them a bit to get them to my liking.  The ceramic tipped tweezers I use for dials, date rings, hands, and other delicate items.  I do occasionally use them to open up case backs, by pushing on a notch.  They've held up to that abuse.  Vintage Dumont #'s 3 and 5 round things out.  I do have some cheap tweezers that I use on occasion when I don't want to risk damaging my good tweezers with a task.

I do like those brass 7s, i have 2 pair of cheap cousins in my set, i might dig them out now.

2 hours ago, ColinC said:

I remember feeling tempted to try and save money on tweezers - but now I feel that I would prefer to have 1 less £30 watch than  struggle with the wrong tool.

I have:

• Bergeon 7026-00 - big heavy things that came with a quick service kit I was given as a present when I started this hobby. Good for pressing canon pinions back in place
• Dumont Brass 1AM - These are my go to tweezers.  I have scratched bridges etc picking them up with the heavy Bergeon tweezers, this is much less likely with these nice brass tweezers.  Downside is that they need to be maintained and are not fine tipped enough open and close incabloc settings or manipulate hair springs
• Dumont, Dumostar #5. For picking up jewels, opening incabloc settings and as the main hand when manipulating hair springs
• Dumont, Dumoxel #6. For holding hairsprings while I stroke with the #5s and for getting things in awkward places the #5s can't reach
   

I am now looking at getting myself a set of cutting tweezers and would be interested in recommendations - the 2 cuts I currently want to make are to the hairspring and to the pin holding the hairspring in the stud.  The pin looks to be more substantial an I am wondering if all cutting tweezers are up to the task?

They should easily cut the brass stud pin, the next size up would be a pair of fingernail clippers which are quite easy to sharpen as well with a mini sanding drum in the old dremel. The inner jaws are a bit tricky to sharpen but when you've done it once you only need to sharpen the outside as long as they dont get chipped.

Edited December 17, 2023 by Neverenoughwatches

[JohnR725]

15 hours ago, ColinC said:

#5

Number five the same brand as my number two  is typically only used for hairsprings. I find any time I start to use them to grab a hold things they have a habit of flying away. So once I complete whatever task I'm using it for a occasionally when I'm putting gears in the watch I might use of the move some things around because the tips are finer than the number two's. But once I complete my task they'll back in the drawer to avoid things flying away.

[nevenbekriev]

I like to use tools made by me. Not that I don’t have fancy swiss made tweezers, but compared to what I use, they seem to me like from  some child-adolescent set of tools… They are stainless and antimagnetic, and this features  together exclude the feature ‘good’…

I also like the straight hairspring tweezers, because if they are good for hairspring work, they generally are good for all other works. That’s why I have reshaped almost all tweezers I have in such manner, I mean pocket watch hairsprings. People usually have a pair of good hairspring tweezers that keep in a special box and use them only for springs, and handle them with extreme care. Not me, I use careless, not afraid what will happen if drop them on the floor and tips bend or something of the sort. Reshaping and sharpening is habit that must be learned and it takes no more than 5 minutes to bring the tweezers in perfect shape.

My advice is to make tweezers this way: get 2 good steel small kitchen knife blades. Rivet them together by 2 rivets on one end, then use bench grinder to shape tweezers out of them. The kitchen knifes are usually stainless, but hot antimagnetic, as they are made of real steel. This is good, as they will be hard and will wear really slowly, and will not lose the shape. Magnetization is not frightful, as demagnetizing, when needed, takes 1-2 sec.

Edited December 18, 2023 by nevenbekriev

[nickelsilver]

23 hours ago, ColinC said:

I am now looking at getting myself a set of cutting tweezers and would be interested in recommendations - the 2 cuts I currently want to make are to the hairspring and to the pin holding the hairspring in the stud.  The pin looks to be more substantial an I am wondering if all cutting tweezers are up to the task?

You want style 15A cutting tweezers. Dumont makes them, as do at least a couple other makers, but beware of cheap ones. I see Dumonts listed with prices all over the place, but pretty sure I paid over a hundred bucks for the last pair I bought. I have several... even brand new there are nuances between them, and certain ones are just better. I do do quite a bit of hairspring work.

[Klassiker]

1 hour ago, nevenbekriev said:

 

@nevenbekriev you've blown my mind (again)! I believe every word and I'm not doubting your approach works for you, but I cannot see me making my own tweezers out of kitchen knives in this lifetime.

For what it's worth; brass Dumont 1AM for me 99% of the time. I have some good quality steel No.4 & No.5 for hairspring work, opening shock springs etc. but picking up small parts with those in my hands is a recipe for disaster.

[Neverenoughwatches]

2 hours ago, nevenbekriev said:

I like to use tools made by me. Not that I don’t have fancy swiss made tweezers, but compared to what I use, they seem to me like from  some child-adolescent set of tools… They are stainless and antimagnetic, and this features  together exclude the feature ‘good’…

I also like the straight hairspring tweezers, because if they are good for hairspring work, they generally are good for all other works. That’s why I have reshaped almost all tweezers I have in such manner, I mean pocket watch hairsprings. People usually have a pair of good hairspring tweezers that keep in a special box and use them only for springs, and handle them with extreme care. Not me, I use careless, not afraid what will happen if drop them on the floor and tips bend or something of the sort. Reshaping and sharpening is habit that must be learned and it takes no more than 5 minutes to bring the tweezers in perfect shape.

My advice is to make tweezers this way: get 2 good steel small kitchen knife blades. Rivet them together by 2 rivets on one end, then use bench grinder to shape tweezers out of them. The kitchen knifes are usually stainless, but hot antimagnetic, as they are made of real steel. This is good, as they will be hard and will wear really slowly, and will not lose the shape. Magnetization is not frightful, as demagnetizing, when needed, takes 1-2 sec.

So Nev, lets just call you Neville after my uncle Nev if thats ok with you ? You can call me Richard or Rich or I'll even let you call me Dicky or Dick when we get to know each other better . Ok so my mind is also blown and Intrigue has grasped me by the short and curlies. We all need to see a picture of your kitchen/ tweezer combo if you please. 

[nevenbekriev]

16 minutes ago, Klassiker said:

@nevenbekriev you've blown my mind (again)! I believe every word and I'm not doubting your approach works for you, but I cannot see me making my own tweezers out of kitchen knives in this lifetime.

Before the ‘Iron Curtain’ fall, in my country was not possible to buy watchmaker tools. There were no any. So, if one wanted to have, then he would receive them by inheritance or make them. And, my father was (unknown) poet and writer…

This is my first lathe, I was 14-15 years old when I made it. The base of it is a Vernier caliper

7 minutes ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

So Nev, lets just call you Neville after my uncle Nev if thats ok with you ? You can call me Richard or Rich or I'll even let you call me Dicky or Dick when we get to know each other better . Ok so my mind is also blown and Intrigue has grasped me by the short and curlies. We all need to see a picture of your kitchen/ tweezer combo if you please. 

I am OK with Nev. No problem, will show pictures. Will make new tweezers to show how. Will try to do before the holidays

[Klassiker]

52 minutes ago, nevenbekriev said:

Before the ‘Iron Curtain’ fall, in my country was not possible to buy watchmaker tools. There were no any. So, if one wanted to have, then he would receive them by inheritance or make them.

I don't want to stray off-topic, but credit where it is due. In the same situation I for one would not display a fraction of your creativity or skill in execution. Are you suggesting that this is normal in Bulgaria? And now you can acquire the commercial tools, but you prefer your self-made ones. How much of your time is spent making tools, and how much putting them to use?

[Neverenoughwatches]

7 minutes ago, Klassiker said:

I don't want to stray off-topic, but credit where it is due. In the same situation I for one would not display a fraction of your creativity or skill in execution. Are you suggesting that this is normal in Bulgaria? And now you can acquire the commercial tools, but you prefer your self-made ones. How much of your time is spent making tools, and how much putting them to use?

Some folk are like this stephen and prefer to custom make their own tools where they can. Having the ability to make something specifically suited to your own needs applies to good tradesmen. I would do it a lot when i was younger, some things i made for a particular use and still have them today ( but no longer used ) i just couldn't find to buy them ( before the internet days. ) I have money now but that trait remains inside me, if i can make it then i make it.

[Klassiker]

I'm pretty good with my hands, but I'm not a professional craftsman. I will make a simple jig or hand tool myself, if it isn't otherwise available. What I don't have is the ability to make tools, from simple ones up to machine tools, which perform as well as or even better than the market leaders, from what otherwise would be scrap. That's a big difference, and I don't know anyone else who can do it either.

[Neverenoughwatches]

5 hours ago, Klassiker said:

I'm pretty good with my hands, but I'm not a professional craftsman. I will make a simple jig or hand tool myself, if it isn't otherwise available. What I don't have is the ability to make tools, from simple ones up to machine tools, which perform as well as or even better than the market leaders, from what otherwise would be scrap. That's a big difference, and I don't know anyone else who can do it either.

Tool making is a trade in its own right,a very skilled old craft similar to instrument makers, none of tnis mass produced rubbish. I have a few books on hand plane making by Jim Kingshott, that blows my mind what he could make and can only dream about being that able. I also have some hand made Japanese chisels, visually they dont have the accuracy of something run through a machine but the handling and edge is unlike anything i have ever used. But you might be surprised what you are capable of when you set your mind to it and given the time. 

[nevenbekriev]

19 hours ago, nevenbekriev said:

... Will make new tweezers to show how...

 

[Knebo]

7 minutes ago, nevenbekriev said:

 

With all due respect to everyone else... this is probably the most impressive thing I've seen on this forum since I joined