Balance issue

[OceanSprint]

Hi, looking for some advice. I have just disassembled, cleaned, reassembled and lubricated a Vostok 2209 movement. I adjusted it and get a very good beat error and the regulation is OK. But the amplitude is really low, just 180 degrees. I have demagnetised the movement. When I look down the microscope, the oscillating hairspring does not look symmetrical. None of the coils are actually touching, but they look closer together the side away from the terminal coil and studs than the side near the terminal coil and studs. Any thoughts? thanks.

[Neverenoughwatches]

1 hour ago, OceanSprint said:

Hi, looking for some advice. I have just disassembled, cleaned, reassembled and lubricated a Vostok 2209 movement. I adjusted it and get a very good beat error and the regulation is OK. But the amplitude is really low, just 180 degrees. I have demagnetised the movement. When I look down the microscope, the oscillating hairspring does not look symmetrical. None of the coils are actually touching, but they look closer together the side away from the terminal coil and studs than the side near the terminal coil and studs. Any thoughts? thanks.

A picture will help.  The best way to center the coils is to remove the hairspring from the balance . Mount the hairspring back onto the balance cock and make adjustments at the stud to center the collet over the balance jewel. This might only be one half of the adjustments needed to fully adjust a hairspring for roundness and flatness. As you can see the hairspring is held at both of its ends so how the hairspring exits the stud AND the collet has an effect on how the hairspring behaves So adjustment at the collet may also be needed ( often not depending if any clumsy previous repair work ) by fitting the balance and hairspring into truing calipers to true the hairspring from its collet point. It can also be done by skeg of E ( eye ) by fitting the collet onto a needle or a broach. Hairspring then has to be remounted back onto the balance in the correct position ( its position should be marked on the balance wheel before removing ) fitted back onto the movement all without disturbing the adjustments that were made. This might sound a lot for a beginner to deal with but it is proper way and a goal to aim for as experience grows. A short cut without all those checks and adjustments, could easily be just one or 2 adjustments at the stud while the balance is fitted to the watch. A simple push pull or twist of the hairspring right as it leaves the stud may be all thats needed to round-up or flatten the hairspring into shape as long as the hairspring is exiting the collet reasonably well ( extra manipulation at the stud could compensate for very slight error at the collet ). If the balance has an Etachron adjustment system things will be much easier to set up. Dont forget  the regulator pins also play a part as well, the hairspring has essentially 3 points of contact 1. At the stud 2. At the collet 3. Between the regulator pins. Pay attention to all 3 areas, but generally its most often exiting at the stud and adjustment of the pins that need looking at. Post up some pickies and folk here will walk you through it.

[rossjackson01]

Good question Ocean. 

Good Answer Never.

Working on hairsprings is my next learning curve endeavour. Starting today. Hairspring, hairspring and hairspring. Practice, practice and practice.

[Neverenoughwatches]

3 hours ago, rossjackson01 said:

Good question Ocean. 

Good Answer Never.

Working on hairsprings is my next learning curve endeavour. Starting today. Hairspring, hairspring and hairspring. Practice, practice and practice.

Practice is very important Ross, you might find that this is the most controlled thing you will have to do up to now over a lengthy period. The practice part facilitates the finest motor skills that we are capable of that we need to be develop to avoid trashing a spring. Its amazing how the brain has such control over the tiniest hand and eye coordination connection. Understanding helps to avoid mistakes, it can be a real struggle when something you expect to happen goes and does the complete opposite.  Take your time and think more than twice about what impact your move has.  A bit like chess, think a few more steps in front of where you are, and occasionally you will go back a step or two to be able to move forward. Very much like everything else in watch repair, unfortunately this little blighter can be very unforgiving of mistakes. Good luck today and above all enjoy it. 

[nevenbekriev]

2209 can be with Breguet hairspring or with flat one, depends on how old the movement is. Please show picture, on which this unsymmetrical hairspring can be seen. Can You do the free oscillations test?

And this dog on the picture, is it Gordon setter?

[Klassiker]

10 hours ago, OceanSprint said:

Any thoughts?

Could be perfectly normal. When the balance is at rest, are the coils evenly spaced? Ideally, post some photos or a link to a video 

[Neverenoughwatches]

1 hour ago, Klassiker said:

Could be perfectly normal. When the balance is at rest, are the coils evenly spaced? Ideally, post some photos or a link to a video 

Flat hairspring oscillations are not symetrical .

[JohnR725]

11 hours ago, OceanSprint said:

When I look down the microscope,

what are the things you want to be careful with the microscope is the phrase when you look down? In other words you're looking straight down at your watch it's a flat object except it's not a flat object it's a three dimensional object that range of what a tip the watch up and look inside ways and see if your hairspring is flat or whether it's touching anything.

11 hours ago, OceanSprint said:

very good beat error and the regulation is OK. But the amplitude is really low, just 180 degrees.

then I assume you have some sort of timing machine? Can we have a picture of the display? I find often times people will look at the numbers and don't look at the graphical part is I don't really understand it and then the numbers can become misleading so it be nice to get a picture of your timing machine results. Not just dial down but maybe crown down also. At least two positions minimum for diagnostic purposes.