Stereo Microscope

[RickTock]

On 11/18/2024 at 3:36 PM, RickTock said:

AmScope started a Black Friday 15% Off Pre-Sale today (enter PRE15 coupon code at checkout), so that was a pleasant surprise.

AmScope just upped the discount from 15% last week to 20%, so thought I would share.

 

[RickTock]

On 11/25/2024 at 2:24 PM, RickTock said:

AmScope just upped the discount from 15% last week to 20%, so thought I would share.

And it looks like Cyber Monday was worth waiting for at AmScope. Impressive!

[Michael1962]

I'm asking a question as to whether anyone knows if I will be happily able to use a stereoscopic microscope as I have 4th nerve palsy in my right eye. This causes the two images that my eyes see to not be in the same place when my brain tries to create one image. I have had my glasses changed so that this symptom is corrected now but I am wondering if using a microscope will negate what my glasses do for me?

Maybe a question for my optometrist?

Edited December 8, 2024 by Michael1962

[spectre6000]

Typically, you can use a stereo microscope while wearing your glasses or not. I've gone both ways. I imagine you'd be pretty well stuck with wearing them since they're correcting something beyond the usual small differences in power. For an answer with enough confidence to justify throwing down a few hundred dollars, an optometrist would probably be your best bet.

[mikepilk]

I don't see why you would have a problem. I have no problem using the microscope wearing glasses. I prefer not to, as the rubber eyepieces fit easier without glasses- same as using binoculars.

 

[Michael1962]

What is the opinion of people with regard to the magnifiers that show up on an LCD/LED screen much like a tablet directly above it?

I am not sure of what sort of working distance you would have?

I don't expect that your spatial relations between where a tool is vs the part of the movement that you wish to access would be very much different to a microscope?

[GPrideaux]

Michael, I assume you mean something like this:

This is an inexpensive (<AU$50) digital microscope that is still my only way of taking micrographs. It's reasonable for what it is and I have found it useful, but there's no comparison between this and a stereo microscope. You can zoom in by moving the camera closer to the work (and adjusting the focus ring) but you can't zoom out enough to be able to see the whole movement. At its highest setting there is enough room, barely, to work on the movement, but I didn't really find that helpful.

Since I got my stereo microscope I find myself doing almost everything under the scope. (I keep my glasses on, otherwise I'd be forever putting them on and off since I can't focus on anything nearer than about a metre without them.) The resolution with the scope is much better than the digital and the binocular vision means I get the advantage of depth perception.

I'm sure it's possible to spend more money and get a much better digital microscope than this, but it's hard to imagine how it could ever compete with the immediacy of the view through microscope optics.

[Michael1962]

Thanks for your reply. Greatly appreciated. If you don't mind me asking, what microscope do you have and where did you get it. I have tried to find microscopes in Australia, but can't seem to find anything comparable to what other users on here talk about.

Costs in Australia seem to be upward of $1,200.

I am trying to decide between microscope and no timegrapher, or timegrapher and single eye loupes for now. I have also been looking at the loupes where you can mix'n'match lenses, but I would need my glasses on under them or I can't focus properly. From what I understand about Fourth Nerve Palsy, I need to wear my glasses all the time as there is a prismatic correction being done in my right lens to align the two images that my eyes see.

[GPrideaux]

Microscope of timegrapher? Tough decision to make! We can't really regulate a watch without some kind of timegrapher, but I think getting by with a low-cost solution for that so that you can get a microscope would be the way to go. I took the advice of people on this forum who said they wished they got a microscope much sooner than they did, and I don't regret it.

I bought my microscope from AliExpress. It's this one: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005006391635924.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.order_list_main.29.64f51802Dlubxj

I paid a total of AU$495.87 including GST and shipping for the model with no camera. I'll probably add a camera to it at some stage, but as I'm not planning to become a YouTuber I figured that could wait, and I'll keep using the electronic cheapie for when I need photos to post on this forum. I've only had it a month, but I wouldn't be without it.

For a timegrapher, I use TG-Timer software (https://tg.ciovil.li/) on a Mac. Some report success with headset microphones but I threw together a Piezo microphone circuit. I sometimes think a commercial timegrapher would be simpler to use, but the software gives me things that a low-end commercial timegrapher wouldn't give such as graphs of the sounds, like below, and I can use the identical setup with Audacity to listen to the watch, too.

I recently modified the TG-Timer software slightly (the beauty of open source software) to write rate, beat and amplitude to STDOUT once per second where it can be captured in a CSV file for analysis. This allows me to log the behaviour of the watch I'm testing as the mainspring unwinds over time so I can analyse it to produce graphs like these:

I can also zoom in to look at cycles like these that show evidence of imperfections on the centre wheel (once per hour spike), the third wheel (once per five minutes spike) and fourth wheel (once per minute waves).

I'm still learning how to make full use of this but as I become more ambitious with my repairs I can see this being a useful diagnostic tool.

If anyone is interested, I can provide details of how I made the piezo microphone, the changes I made to tg-timer and the R Shiny code I use to generate the graphs above, but that's off topic here, I think.

9 hours ago, Michael1962 said:

From what I understand about Fourth Nerve Palsy, I need to wear my glasses all the time as there is a prismatic correction being done in my right lens to align the two images that my eyes see.

Generally using a loupe means using the eyes independently of each other, so you may be able to get by without your corrective lenses, but you probably want to consider something that clips on to your glasses since its a pain to be forever swapping glasses on and off.

When I can't use my microscope, and what I used consistently before I got it was this stereo magnifier mounted on a velcro headband:

It gives me something like x5 or x10 magnification, I guess, it swings up easily when I don't want it, and it fits over my glasses. I inherited this one (my dad used to use it for model ship building) and I have found it immeasurably easier to use than single loupes. There is a second plastic lens inside that flips down to double the magnification, but I mostly use it without that.

[Neverenoughwatches]

10 hours ago, Michael1962 said:

Thanks for your reply. Greatly appreciated. If you don't mind me asking, what microscope do you have and where did you get it. I have tried to find microscopes in Australia, but can't seem to find anything comparable to what other users on here talk about.

Costs in Australia seem to be upward of $1,200.

I am trying to decide between microscope and no timegrapher, or timegrapher and single eye loupes for now. I have also been looking at the loupes where you can mix'n'match lenses, but I would need my glasses on under them or I can't focus properly. From what I understand about Fourth Nerve Palsy, I need to wear my glasses all the time as there is a prismatic correction being done in my right lens to align the two images that my eyes see.

The simple answer for me...is to have the microscope . As we often say on here, you can't fix what you can't see. Watchmakers managed for centuries without a timegrapher, but what they could not do without was good magnification. If you are good with loupes and are comfortable using them then possibly the timegrapher.  I know i could overcome not having a tg,( nice to have but not a necessity) a good microscope will allow me to see what the balance is doing and enable me to find most other issues. A good way to avoid becoming a slave and worshipping the tg is to not have one

[RickTock]

On 11/18/2024 at 3:36 PM, RickTock said:

Thanks to all of the information gleaned from this post (and a couple of excellent YouTube vids), I took the plunge today and ordered a Microscope from AmScope and camera from AliExpress. Here's what I ordered:

• AmScope SM-3TPX Simul-Focal Zoom Trinocular Stereo Microscope 3.5X-45X Magnification on Single Arm Boom Stand (includes 0.5X Barlow lens)
• AmScope 144 LED Intensity-adjustable Ring Light for Stereo Microscopes with White Housing
• HAYEAR HY-3307 Digital HDMI USB Microscope Camera 16MP 1080P
• HAYEAR 0.35X C-mount Adapter

AmScope started a Black Friday 15% Off Pre-Sale today (enter PRE15 coupon code at checkout), so that was a pleasant surprise. AliExpress pricing was also lower today.

The two videos I found most helpful were from:

• Alex Hamilton - The One Tool That Will Make You a Better Watchmaker
• Kalle Slaap - Microscope special Part 2of2 - My personal set-up and why

I'll follow up with a brief review once I have some bench time with the new gear.

Cheers!

--Rick

 

 

Back in this post, I promised a (brief!) review of the microscope I purchased from AmScope and camera from AliExpress. Brevity seems to have escaped me -- perhaps this was more complex than I thought!

The AmScope order was placed on November 18, shipped the next day via FedEx International Economy, and delivered November 22. At US$120, shipping was expensive. But microscopes are heavy, and I wasn't up for the 10,000 km round trip to pick it up! And it got here pretty quick considering it travelled from the east coast of the United States to the west coast of Canada. Canadian federal and provincial taxes were collected by AmScope, so the order sailed through customs without delay. Everything was well packed and arrived undamaged.

As expected, the camera from AliExpress took a little longer to arrive, but no complaints from me as I prioritized low cost vs. speed of delivery for this component. Ordered November 18 and delivered December 4 (still quick all things considered).

The microscope was easy to assemble but took me a few rounds of trial and error to get it situated on my workbench 'just right.' I have the microscope head tilted back toward me on a 10° angle which seems just enough to allow me to control placement of screwdriver blades in screw slots. This means that the very top and bottom of my view are ever so slightly out of focus, but not enough to have an impact on any work I've been doing. So far I'm really impressed with the microscope. It is a huge ergonomic upgrade for my tired old body, and at least doubles my ability to do precision cleaning, inspection and lubrication.

The ring light feels a little cheaper than the microscope (light weight plastic vs. heavy metal construction). But it does a good job and was inexpensive. It has a rheostat to adjust brightness which I really appreciate. I typically run it closer to it's lowest setting when zoomed out and on full brightness zoomed in. The power cord is unsightly but generally out of the way without much effort. There is a switch to turn the light on and off (separate from the rheostat) and a little green LED that lights up when the unit is connected to power. In my perfect world, the green LED would turn off when the light is switched off, but that is really more of an observation than complaint.

The camera arrived after I was pretty familiar with the microscope, and I think that was beneficial to my learning curve. The microscope had a long adjustable tube with no optics that was to be used for mounting the camera. I didn't use that at all. Rather, I installed a 'Focus Adjustable 0.35X C-mount Adapter' between the camera and microscope. This alone did not provide enough adjustment to allow simultaneous focus of the camera and eyepieces, and I ended up adding a 2mm spacer between the camera and 0.35X adapter to get the camera focus synced with what I was viewing in the microscope. I wasn't sure what size spacer would work best with my setup, so I purchased four sizes: 1mm and 2mm spacers, and 5mm and 10mm threaded adapters. These all came from the same vendor on AliExpress (link below), and were so inexpensive that paying extra for the ability to have some trial and error flexibility worked well for me.

Instructions with the HAYEAR camera were not great but enough to get going. There are basically two different ways to use the camera:

First, I tried connecting camera with an HDMI cable to an external monitor. Works as advertised but I didn't like having a big LCD monitor on my workbench, and my HDMI cable is a bothersome brute that I also didn't like having around the workbench. When using this setup you need to power the camera with the supplied power adapter, and photos and videos could be captured to an SD card (not supplied) placed in the camera. There's a remote control (that didn't come with a battery, or even an indicator of what kind of batter was appropriate) that is used for taking pictures and such. I didn't like anything about this setup, but it did work.

Second, I tried connecting camera to my MacBook Pro with the supplied USB cable. This eliminates the power adapter, the LCD monitor and the unwieldy HDMI cable from my workbench. Much better! Tricky part here was getting software on the computer that could capture photos and video. HEYEAR's website has software, but it is a bit hard to find and install, and didn't work well. I ended up downloading software called ToupLite from another microscope vendor. It is the software that HEYEAR's is based on, but with all the functionality I required working properly.

I took some photos with my iPhone through the eyepiece of the microscope to compare what I see vs. what the camera sees. First two photos are with the microscope zoomed all the way out, first through the eyepiece then the HAYEAR camera:

Next, zoomed all the way in:

Here's a screenshot of the software:

Here's a shot of the microscope in its working orientation:

And swung out of the way:

And finally, links for everything:

• AmScope SM-3TPX Simul-Focal Zoom Trinocular Stereo Microscope 3.5X-45X Magnification on Single Arm Boom Stand (includes 0.5X Barlow lens)
• AmScope 144 LED Intensity-adjustable Ring Light for Stereo Microscopes with White Housing
• HAYEAR HY-3307 Digital HDMI USB Microscope Camera 16MP 1080P
• HAYEAR 0.35X C-mount Adapter
• C-mount Spacers

If you've stayed with me this far, thanks for reading! Let me know if you have any questions.

Cheers!

Edited January 3 by RickTock

[LittleWatchShop]

I need to get a camera for my trinocular amscope. I got the scope a year ago, but have hardly used it.

[GPrideaux]

2 hours ago, LittleWatchShop said:

I got the scope a year ago, but have hardly used it.

I also have no camera on my scope, but I use it all the time, for almost everything! Much more than I thought I would.

[Michael1962]

On 10/17/2018 at 3:09 AM, transporter said:

To be fair guys nothing beats a  Loup and the eyeball but this can be used for servicing, the base is a bit slippy but attaching the aforementioned card will sort that, the camera cannot be angled so it’s vertical I’m afraid. The magnification is adjustable by moving it up or down, at the highest point it is more than acceptable to use for servicing.

Hi, I am thinking of one of these after reading this post as I am unsure of using a binocular microscope with the particular condition that I have with my eyes. Optometrist is on holidays.

Is it easy enough to be looking at the image on the screen and working below? Something tells me that it would feel different to a microscope, but I might be completely wrong about that.

Does this little unit allow you to sit more vertical instead of being hunched over for long periods of time?

[mikepilk]

I originally got a cheap USB microscope. Useful for examining parts, but totally useless for working on a movement :There's a slight delay, and as it's not under your line of sight like a stereo microscope. 

Is there any way you could try out a stereo microscope before buying one? They are a game changer. I do 95% of all work under one.

 

[Michael1962]

Bugger. Thanks for letting us know about the delay.

[GuyMontag]

32 minutes ago, Michael1962 said:

Bugger. Thanks for letting us know about the delay.

One thing you could try is to hook up a monitor to the camera on the stereo microscope and if you are unable to work using the scope there wouldn't there be any delay when connecting the camera to the monitor via HDMI so that you may then be able to use the monitor instead of the scope for viewing.
 

Edited January 6 by GuyMontag

[Knebo]

On 1/5/2025 at 1:06 PM, mikepilk said:

I originally got a cheap USB microscope. Useful for examining parts, but totally useless for working on a movement :There's a slight delay, and as it's not under your line of sight like a stereo microscope. 

Is there any way you could try out a stereo microscope before buying one? They are a game changer. I do 95% of all work under one.

 

I completely agree. I've also tried various other ways of magnifying and everything is now rotting in a drawer. To work under directly, a stereo microscope is the only way. I agree it's a game changer. But seeing is believing, so try it out somewhere! 

[gpraceman]

On 1/3/2025 at 3:49 PM, RickTock said:

Back in this post, I promised a (brief!) review of the microscope I purchased from AmScope and camera from AliExpress. Brevity seems to have escaped me -- perhaps this was more complex than I thought!

The AmScope order was placed on November 18, shipped the next day via FedEx International Economy, and delivered November 22. At US$120, shipping was expensive. But microscopes are heavy, and I wasn't up for the 10,000 km round trip to pick it up! And it got here pretty quick considering it travelled from the east coast of the United States to the west coast of Canada. Canadian federal and provincial taxes were collected by AmScope, so the order sailed through customs without delay. Everything was well packed and arrived undamaged.

As expected, the camera from AliExpress took a little longer to arrive, but no complaints from me as I prioritized low cost vs. speed of delivery for this component. Ordered November 18 and delivered December 4 (still quick all things considered).

The microscope was easy to assemble but took me a few rounds of trial and error to get it situated on my workbench 'just right.' I have the microscope head tilted back toward me on a 10° angle which seems just enough to allow me to control placement of screwdriver blades in screw slots. This means that the very top and bottom of my view are ever so slightly out of focus, but not enough to have an impact on any work I've been doing. So far I'm really impressed with the microscope. It is a huge ergonomic upgrade for my tired old body, and at least doubles my ability to do precision cleaning, inspection and lubrication.

The ring light feels a little cheaper than the microscope (light weight plastic vs. heavy metal construction). But it does a good job and was inexpensive. It has a rheostat to adjust brightness which I really appreciate. I typically run it closer to it's lowest setting when zoomed out and on full brightness zoomed in. The power cord is unsightly but generally out of the way without much effort. There is a switch to turn the light on and off (separate from the rheostat) and a little green LED that lights up when the unit is connected to power. In my perfect world, the green LED would turn off when the light is switched off, but that is really more of an observation than complaint.

The camera arrived after I was pretty familiar with the microscope, and I think that was beneficial to my learning curve. The microscope had a long adjustable tube with no optics that was to be used for mounting the camera. I didn't use that at all. Rather, I installed a 'Focus Adjustable 0.35X C-mount Adapter' between the camera and microscope. This alone did not provide enough adjustment to allow simultaneous focus of the camera and eyepieces, and I ended up adding a 2mm spacer between the camera and 0.35X adapter to get the camera focus synced with what I was viewing in the microscope. I wasn't sure what size spacer would work best with my setup, so I purchased four sizes: 1mm and 2mm spacers, and 5mm and 10mm threaded adapters. These all came from the same vendor on AliExpress (link below), and were so inexpensive that paying extra for the ability to have some trial and error flexibility worked well for me.

Instructions with the HAYEAR camera were not great but enough to get going. There are basically two different ways to use the camera:

First, I tried connecting camera with an HDMI cable to an external monitor. Works as advertised but I didn't like having a big LCD monitor on my workbench, and my HDMI cable is a bothersome brute that I also didn't like having around the workbench. When using this setup you need to power the camera with the supplied power adapter, and photos and videos could be captured to an SD card (not supplied) placed in the camera. There's a remote control (that didn't come with a battery, or even an indicator of what kind of batter was appropriate) that is used for taking pictures and such. I didn't like anything about this setup, but it did work.

Second, I tried connecting camera to my MacBook Pro with the supplied USB cable. This eliminates the power adapter, the LCD monitor and the unwieldy HDMI cable from my workbench. Much better! Tricky part here was getting software on the computer that could capture photos and video. HEYEAR's website has software, but it is a bit hard to find and install, and didn't work well. I ended up downloading software called ToupLite from another microscope vendor. It is the software that HEYEAR's is based on, but with all the functionality I required working properly.

I took some photos with my iPhone through the eyepiece of the microscope to compare what I see vs. what the camera sees. First two photos are with the microscope zoomed all the way out, first through the eyepiece then the HAYEAR camera:

Next, zoomed all the way in:

Here's a screenshot of the software:

Here's a shot of the microscope in its working orientation:

And swung out of the way:

And finally, links for everything:

• AmScope SM-3TPX Simul-Focal Zoom Trinocular Stereo Microscope 3.5X-45X Magnification on Single Arm Boom Stand (includes 0.5X Barlow lens)
• AmScope 144 LED Intensity-adjustable Ring Light for Stereo Microscopes with White Housing
• HAYEAR HY-3307 Digital HDMI USB Microscope Camera 16MP 1080P
• HAYEAR 0.35X C-mount Adapter
• C-mount Spacers

If you've stayed with me this far, thanks for reading! Let me know if you have any questions.

Cheers!

If I recall correctly, the USB connection will not provide the max resolution of the camera.  For that, you would need to record to the micro SD card.

If you are running Windows, you can use the built-in Camera app and view/record/take photos from that.

I have a slim HDMI cable, which is easier to deal with to connect to my monitor.

Overall, I have been disappointed with the typical microscope camera setup.  If I can see the whole movement in the eyepieces I want to be able to see the whole movement through the camera.  The problem boils down to needing a larger image sensor for the camera.  Instead of buying a much more expensive camera, I am working on getting the pieces to connect my DSLR to the microscope.  I should have those by Thursday.  Hopefully, that will better match with the FOV through the eyepieces, even if there is vignetting.

[gpraceman]

I was finally able to get my Nikon D3500 DSLR setup to use with my microscope.  I want to thank @GuyMontag for modifying his 3D printed microscope adapter design so I could get the camera image to focus properly.  The shorter adapter did the trick.  His new design file allows for the easy customization of the height.

The setup I ended up with is a F mount to M42 lens adapter, a M42 to M42 mm focusing helicoid, and the 3D printed microscope adapter to connect the DSLR to the microscope.

This setup gives a much better field of view than the microscope camera, with 0.35X camera mount, setup that I was using.  With minimum zoom, through the eyepieces I get a 57 mm field of view.  Through the DSLR, I get about 60 mm FOV.  There is vignetting in the corners, but I was rather expecting that.  My goal was to get the whole movement in the FOV, which wasn't happening with the microscope camera setup.

Edited January 17 by gpraceman

[spectre6000]

Is that with the camera body directly on the adapter, or can you get lenses on top of that? The idea being having the ability to match the zoom level of higher magnification eyepieces.

[gpraceman]

33 minutes ago, spectre6000 said:

Is that with the camera body directly on the adapter, or can you get lenses on top of that? The idea being having the ability to match the zoom level of higher magnification eyepieces.

Camera body -> lens adapter -> helicoid -> microscope adapter.

I assume that I could use a M42 lens instead of the helicoid or just use a regular lens on the camera body and make up a 3D printed microscope adapter that will thread onto the end of the lens.

[AndrewR]

On 3/26/2014 at 3:07 PM, Lee said:

to be honest I haven't the faintest idea what I need. the one I linked was one another watch repairer has & he sent me the link. the specs are boggling I assume I need a zoom version for ease? & I like taking images of things I do to (currently use a USB microscope & a camera.)

 

Lee

I am in a similar boat to you. I've been looking at AliExpress (which does have guarantees and safeguards) which lowers the cost (but you have to check what's included, VAT, shipping etc.). Knowing what mag you actually need is good because ywe're not looking for microbes. Reading that 50x is as high as you need/want helps narrow the field.

I'm looking for stereo with a camera, on a boom system. As I haven't bought from AlX there looks like a 30% discount too!!

On 12/25/2024 at 1:39 AM, Michael1962 said:

Thanks for your reply. Greatly appreciated. If you don't mind me asking, what microscope do you have and where did you get it. I have tried to find microscopes in Australia, but can't seem to find anything comparable to what other users on here talk about.

Costs in Australia seem to be upward of $1,200.

I am trying to decide between microscope and no timegrapher, or timegrapher and single eye loupes for now. I have also been looking at the loupes where you can mix'n'match lenses, but I would need my glasses on under them or I can't focus properly. From what I understand about Fourth Nerve Palsy, I need to wear my glasses all the time as there is a prismatic correction being done in my right lens to align the two images that my eyes see.

There are some OK tiemgrapher apps for smartphones. Nowhere near as good as a the real thing but it depends how far you want to go now, good enough or expert?

On 1/5/2025 at 12:06 PM, mikepilk said:

I originally got a cheap USB microscope. Useful for examining parts, but totally useless for working on a movement :There's a slight delay, and as it's not under your line of sight like a stereo microscope. 

Is there any way you could try out a stereo microscope before buying one? They are a game changer. I do 95% of all work under one.

 

Yeah mine is OK but jittery. And on the odd occasion is freezes. Not a lot of space to work under but OK for inspection.

On 1/3/2025 at 10:49 PM, RickTock said:

 

Instructions with the HAYEAR camera were not great but enough to get going. There are basically two different ways to use the camera:

First, I tried connecting camera with an HDMI cable to an external monitor. Works as advertised but I didn't like having a big LCD monitor on my workbench, and my HDMI cable is a bothersome brute that I also didn't like having around the workbench. When using this setup you need to power the camera with the supplied power adapter, and photos and videos could be captured to an SD card (not supplied) placed in the camera. There's a remote control (that didn't come with a battery, or even an indicator of what kind of batter was appropriate) that is used for taking pictures and such. I didn't like 

Cheers!

It wouldn't work with Quicktime to record?

Edited January 17 by AndrewR

[RickTock]

On 1/17/2025 at 9:29 AM, AndrewR said:

It wouldn't work with Quicktime to record?

I hadn't thought of that. QuickTime Player will record a video via the Hayear camera. But I haven't found a good way to simply snap a photo using the software that comes with macOS. Photo Booth gets you close but has annoying quirks. Any ideas?

[AndrewR]

6 hours ago, RickTock said:

I hadn't thought of that. QuickTime Player will record a video via the Hayear camera. But I haven't found a good way to simply snap a photo using the software that comes with macOS. Photo Booth gets you close but has annoying quirks. Any ideas?

I do use Photobooth for snaps. But you do need to make the settings flip your image to normal. You can also turn off the annoying countdown as well, or at least use a button combination that bypasses it. (ChatGPT/Google Gemini are your friends)

Otherwise I just take a screengrab from Quicktime (cmd/shift/4)

Edited January 19 by AndrewR