Cleaning after pegging jewels

[Waggy]

My usual method of pre-cleaning is to use peg wood to 'peg the jewels' then once this has removed/dislodged the gunk use a pointy type cotton bud dipped in IPA to clean the jewels and larger watch items. However, this weekend I was trying to remove that awful graphite grease (or at least I think it was) and the IPA was having a tough time lifting it. I switched to naphtha (lighter fluid) and the gunk was gone in a second. I am now questioning my use of IPA, why don't I switch to  naphtha as my follow up cleaning solvent after pegging?

Thoughts?

[Knebo]

Interesting observation.

I generally use Essence Renata or washing benzine, i.e. solvents similar to lighter fluid for any manual cleaning tasks. I'm happy with it.

[nickelsilver]

Alcohol is a polar solvent, which isn't very good for cleaning grease. Benzine (lighter fluid), hexane etc. are non-polar solvents and are far better for grease. Essence Renata is heptane, which is also non-polar.

[rjenkinsgb]

Acetone is a pretty good solvent degreaser for metal parts, and is rather safer than either naphtha or benzine, as small amounts are naturally produced and metabolised in the body.

Just keep it away from most plastics & finishes!

(OSHA limits for a eight hour exposure: Acetone 1000ppm, Heptane 500ppm, Benzine/Light naphtha 350ppm, Naphtha 100ppm).

Naphtha (the 100ppm one) can contain trace amounts of Benzene, which is a carcinogen.

[I used the US standards as Naphtha is not generally listed in the UK documents & I wanted all data from the same source].

[Neverenoughwatches]

17 hours ago, Waggy said:

My usual method of pre-cleaning is to use peg wood to 'peg the jewels' then once this has removed/dislodged the gunk use a pointy type cotton bud dipped in IPA to clean the jewels and larger watch items. However, this weekend I was trying to remove that awful graphite grease (or at least I think it was) and the IPA was having a tough time lifting it. I switched to naphtha (lighter fluid) and the gunk was gone in a second. I am now questioning my use of IPA, why don't I switch to  naphtha as my follow up cleaning solvent after pegging?

Thoughts?

I switched to naptha a while back for that very reason, i only use alcohols for rinses now. 

[nickelsilver]

10 hours ago, rjenkinsgb said:

Acetone is a pretty good solvent degreaser for metal parts, and is rather safer than either naphtha or benzine, as small amounts are naturally produced and metabolised in the body.

Just keep it away from most plastics & finishes!

(OSHA limits for a eight hour exposure: Acetone 1000ppm, Heptane 500ppm, Benzine/Light naphtha 350ppm, Naphtha 100ppm).

Naphtha (the 100ppm one) can contain trace amounts of Benzene, which is a carcinogen.

[I used the US standards as Naphtha is not generally listed in the UK documents & I wanted all data from the same source].

Naphtha covers a number of different hydrocarbons, including what is commonly called lighter fluid, aka benzine, and then some seemingly more nasty ones. Some talk with CAS numbers in this thread:

I'm quite sure the naphtha I got in that post was the bad stuff, definitely not something you want to be around much.

[Knebo]

13 hours ago, rjenkinsgb said:

Acetone is a pretty good solvent degreaser for metal parts, and is rather safer than either naphtha or benzine, as small amounts are naturally produced and metabolised in the body.

Just keep it away from most plastics & finishes!

(OSHA limits for a eight hour exposure: Acetone 1000ppm, Heptane 500ppm, Benzine/Light naphtha 350ppm, Naphtha 100ppm).

Naphtha (the 100ppm one) can contain trace amounts of Benzene, which is a carcinogen.

[I used the US standards as Naphtha is not generally listed in the UK documents & I wanted all data from the same source].

Interesting! Thanks for sharing this.

I wonder, though, if the substances evaporate in similar quantities. What I mean is: let's say, if we open one container with acetone and one with naphtha for 10 seconds each. How many PPM's of each would go into the air for us to breathe in?

Hypothetically, if acetone (1000ppm OSHA limit) evaporates 10 times faster than naphtha (100ppm OSHA limit), then they'd actually be equivalent in practical use.

Anyways... if feel relatively safe with these solvents because I only open the jars very briefly and close immediate + I always open the windows wide when I do anything with these solvents.

 

[Waggy]

3 hours ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

I switched to naptha a while back for that very reason, i only use alcohols for rinses now. 

I think from my own findings and what has been said here that I'll switch to naphtha as my post-pegging solvent, its also more compatible with my watch cleaning chemicals too. Making a new batch of watch cleaning solution and rinse solutions this weekend!

[Neverenoughwatches]

42 minutes ago, Waggy said:

I think from my own findings and what has been said here that I'll switch to naphtha as my post-pegging solvent, its also more compatible with my watch cleaning chemicals too. Making a new batch of watch cleaning solution and rinse solutions this weekend!

Lol. Just you be careful beaker

Edited June 4, 2024 by Neverenoughwatches

[mikepilk]

When pegging and doing a pre-clean on very dirty movements I always use naphtha. As mentioned above, IPA isn't good solvent for oils and grease.

[caseback]

Try rubbing/rolling a piece of rodico on/over the parts after pegging the jewels and the really dirty bits (like inside the barrel etc). You'll find that the rodico will remove most of the dirt.

[nickelsilver]

Most watch companies have effectively banned rodico use, because it leaves a film that oil travels on very easily. It leaves a visually clean surface though.

[thor447]

On 6/4/2024 at 6:50 AM, mikepilk said:

When pegging and doing a pre-clean on very dirty movements I always use naphtha. As mentioned above, IPA isn't good solvent for oils and grease.

+1 for naphtha.  

[mikepilk]

8 hours ago, nickelsilver said:

Most watch companies have effectively banned rodico use, because it leaves a film that oil travels on very easily. It leaves a visually clean surface though.

Interesting. I find Rodico very useful. Maybe a final wipe with IPA will remove the film.

[Neverenoughwatches]

8 hours ago, nickelsilver said:

Most watch companies have effectively banned rodico use, because it leaves a film that oil travels on very easily. It leaves a visually clean surface though.

I can well believe that, i stopped using it over a year ago, i think its horrible stuff. Definitely have to use finger covering as it soaks up skin oils like a sponge. I always kept the bit i was using in a little container in an attempt to keep it clean but still had to change it frequently. Once its been used to mop up a little over oiling or pick up a bit of dirt i found it had to be binned shortly after. I very rarely use it unless its to stick something in place. Instead i use jewel pickers or the toothpick condoms as they can be rinsed, dried and reused 

[mikepilk]

20 minutes ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

I can well believe that, i stopped using it over a year ago, i think its horrible stuff. Definitely have to use finger covering as it soaks up skin oils like a sponge. I always kept the bit i was using in a little container in an attempt to keep it clean but still had to change it frequently. Once its been used to mop up a little over oiling or pick up a bit of dirt i found it had to be binned shortly after. I very rarely use it unless its to stick something in place. Instead i use jewel pickers or the toothpick condoms as they can be rinsed, dried and reused 

That's exactly what I do Rich. I always handle it with finger cots, only use small bits, and throw them away once contaminated. I have a jewel picker upper, but the tip wore out, so I stick a little bit of Rodico on the end instead

[Neverenoughwatches]

1 hour ago, mikepilk said:

That's exactly what I do Rich. I always handle it with finger cots, only use small bits, and throw them away once contaminated. I have a jewel picker upper, but the tip wore out, so I stick a little bit of Rodico on the end instead

Have you tried this idea Mike, i picked it up from Nicklesilver ages ago, i nicknamed them toothpick condoms ,  just a toothpick dipped in Evo contact adhesive . Just like doning a rubber, except this one picks things up instead of rejecting them .  Not as sticky as a jewel picker but i often use it for that, mostly for picking up floated down bits of debris and hairs. Great for holding down springs as they have loads of grip like a rubber band. Give em a go.

[Waggy]

4 minutes ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

Evo contact adhesive

What is this stuff? do you have a picture of the tin or a link? And how do you use it?

[RichardHarris123]

This stuff but the brand doesn't matter.

[Neverenoughwatches]

1 hour ago, Waggy said:

What is this stuff? do you have a picture of the tin or a link? And how do you use it?

I use use it for sticking laminate edges on kitchen worktops, but for these just dip them in the stuff , takes about an hour for it to cure.

1 hour ago, RichardHarris123 said:

This stuff but the brand doesn't matter.

This is a really good one, I've used others in the past but i found that this is the  best .

[RichardHarris123]

24 minutes ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

I use use it for sticking laminate edges on kitchen worktops, but for these just dip them in the stuff , takes about an hour for it to cure.

This is a really good one, I've used others in the past but i found that this is the  best .

I was thinking that for making sticky sticks, the brand wouldn't really matter. 

[Neverenoughwatches]

27 minutes ago, RichardHarris123 said:

I was thinking that for making sticky sticks, the brand wouldn't really matter. 

Just my experience of using other contact adhesives Rich, Evo- Stick has never failed to work for other applications i use it for. It sets just like rubber, there might be another brand that is like it.

[nickelsilver]

38 minutes ago, RichardHarris123 said:

I was thinking that for making sticky sticks, the brand wouldn't really matter. 

The fellow who showed me this said if anything he preferred the cheapest no-name stuff you find in discount markets. I used to use Continental cement for tubular bike tires as I always had it on hand. Never could tell a difference on the toothpicks.

[mikepilk]

I thought a little experiment was due (as I currently have no watches to work on  )

I cleaned a copper plate (scrubbed with soap, wiped with 99.9% IPA, so it passes the "water break test")

On test were :

(1) a clean section

(2) one where I'd wiped with some clean Rodico, 

(3) wiped with Rodico but then wiped with IPA on a cotton bud

(4) clean, then wiped with dried Evostick on pegwood (to see if Evostick leaves any residue)

I put on drops of HP1300 and 9010. Unfortunately I don't have an automatic oiler to put same size drops on each section. So the drop size did vary a bit.

After 30 minutes - all the dots look similar. Maybe the Rodico section have spread a touch?

Looking under the microscope at an angle, there is definitely less surface tension on the Rodico drops (the drop is flatter) for both HP1300 and 9010. See pics below.
All other drops look similar.
(Maybe I should have done multiple drops)

Conclusions.

a) The Rodico wiped section did seem to effect surface tension on the oil droplets.

b) After using Rodico, a wipe with IPA seems to remove the residue.

c) Evostick does not seem to leave a residue

d) I desperately need to get a watch to work on, so I stop doing silly experiments 

 

[VWatchie]

On 6/10/2024 at 1:38 AM, nickelsilver said:

Most watch companies have effectively banned rodico use, because it leaves a film that oil travels on very easily.

I always clean my pallets by hand in clean unused Horosolv using a paint brush and then use Rodico to remove microscopic residues of the degreaser. I always use a brand new piece of Rodico for this purpose and the result naturally looks absolutely perfect because, as you mention, the film left by Rodico cannot be seen. Next, I treat the stones with Fixodrop and then apply Moebius 9415. Does this film you mention have any short-term or long-term negative effects?