service video of more complex Seiko movement

[Terrinecold]

Hello,

looking on youtube for videos of servicing of more complex Seiko movements.  I basically only see the low grade movement used in most US imported Seiko (like the 7S26 and 4R36 and related movements).  I am interested in seeing things like the 4S27 which is in my SAGN011 watch or the 6R20 6R24 6R27 8Rxx chronographs and so on.  Basically anything else than the ones we always see.

Am I just not looking well enough or are they no such videos?

 

[AndyGSi]

I think it's the rarity and complexity with likes of the 4S27 that doesn't warrant a video being made as they're not going to get the views.

[Terrinecold]

Interesting, those are exactly the reason I would be interested in them.

In the end what got me into this hobby is the intricacies of mechanical movements and the complexity of what can be achieved with these technology.

I hope I am not shocking anyone when I say that from a purely functional point of view, nowadays mechanical watches are pointless but I love the beauty of the mechanisms the fact that despite their diminutive sizes they can run so well for so long.

I work in software engineering (for 25 years) and I find the manual craftmanship which goes into maintaining those (I am not going to talk about building because I know that any modern watch I'd be willing/able to pay for will have been built mostly if not all by machines) fascinating, the more complex the more so.

 

I also have to say that on the other hand I find plenty of videos about servicing of vintage swiss watches including complicated ones and I find that it gives an impression that only swiss made complex mechanical watches and all the other are reduced to at most automatic, center seconds and date.

[JohnR725]

34 minutes ago, Terrinecold said:

I hope I am not shocking anyone when I say that from a purely functional point of view, nowadays mechanical watches are pointless

Interesting thought but it brings up the problem of why are watch companies still making mechanical watches? Unless the purchasers of mechanical watches disagree with your point of view?

54 minutes ago, AndyGSi said:

rarity

I had to go and look up the watch I wasn't sure quite what it was. The problem with YouTube video is in order for them to make a video they have to have a watch to service. Then I'm a make a wild assumption that these are probably pricey watches and that would mean a lot a YouTube channels probably don't have the money to purchase something like this for the purpose of making a video. So you could help out one ear YouTube jails by purchasing one and see if they would service it make a video as I've seen a number of channels commenting somebody sent this watch to me for servicing.

https://reference.grail-watch.com/family/seiko-4s/

 

[Terrinecold]

I think they are making them because they can sell them.

I don't think the purchaser (which I am one of) disagree.  I think they are considered to be mostly jewelry and appreciated for what they are (see the above on my fascination with their mechanism).

I don't think any maker of mechanical watch thinks that they do any of their function better than what can be done with a quartz watch in particular if solar.

Now note that I said "from a purely functional point of view".  The amount of products which are sold and which we (including me) buy which have a value for non "purely functional" reason is staggering.

But when I do buy a mechanical watch I don't do it because I think it will be better at giving me the time than the phone I carry with me all the time or any other thing.

When I buy clothes I don't just consider the functionality of them, I do consider what I will look like in them.

And so on and so forth.

About the 4S27 as mentioned a few time I do have one which I got 20 years ago as a present for my 30th birthday.  I had it serviced a couple times since then with a lot of difficulty because finding a watchmaker in Boston who would accept to do it (most who actually service watches which I contacted just sniffed and put their nose up when I said it was a Seiko).  I unfortunately broke something in the movements a few years back when I dropped the watch while picking it up from a locker after climbing.  I sent it to Seiko US who wouldn't touch it and sent it to Seiko Japan who repaired it (for almost the price I paid for it new but it has great sentimental value to me).  Right now one of the links is damaged and it will again be repaired by Seiko Japan when my wife goes there this summer.  I scoured the internet and couldn't find an original bracelet or link for sail without the whole watch.

I have to say I hope one day to be confident enough to open it up and service it myself but that day is definitely not now.

 

[AndyGSi]

I know it's going off topic from the original post but @Terrinecold, what do you mean when you say the link is damaged?

Edited June 22, 2024 by AndyGSi

[Terrinecold]

This, you see how this one link doesn't articulate correctly 

You can see how the back of the links are. But only that one behaves that way

[RichardHarris123]

18 minutes ago, JohnR725 said:

Interesting thought but it brings up the problem of why are watch companies still making mechanical watches?

Because people like us watch enthusiasts find the movements fascinating. A simple movement, no complications, should be a relatively simple device, consisting of  relatively few components but as we all know it it's actually incredibly complicated.  You are far more experienced than me, so I don't have to mention tolerances, poise etc.

Some people aren't into watch repair but appreciate the quality of a mechanical movement, even if they had never seen a movement, nor undestand them. 

Finally, posers who want Rolex et al because they are vain. 

[Terrinecold]

And a picture of the watch itself 

Just now, RichardHarris123 said:

Because people like us watch enthusiasts find the movements fascinating. A simple movement, no complications, should be a relatively simple device, consisting of  relatively few components but as we all know it it's actually incredibly complicated.  You are far more experienced than me, so I don't have to mention tolerances, poise etc.

Some people aren't into watch repair but appreciate the quality of a mechanical movement, even if they had never seen a movement, nor undestand them. 

Finally, posers who want Rolex et al because they are vain. 

Yes exactly what I was trying to express.  I didn't want to offend anyone.  People including us are buying them that is why watch company make them.  We buy them because we like them but normally not because we think they keep better time than alternative.  we buy them because they are beautiful and fascinating.  

[oldhippy]

Back in the 70's and 80's we never had the internet or these videos you have now. We had to learn from scratch. You could write it down, learn from memory or find your own way of how to go about it. Service manuals were hard to get, you had to wait a long time to get some of them and not all were available. Customers wanted their watches repaired ASAP.  Cameras were no good for this type of work you had to get the film developed and that cost money. It is so easier these days to service complicated watches.   

[Terrinecold]

Not surprised I can say for sure that without internet and YouTube I would never have started this hobby or considered that it could be one

I would probably have been making model trains or airplanes

[watchweasol]

The main reason there is little information is that with the complexity of the watch and no or very little service information it has to go back to the factory for service/repair.  But unlike Swatch it’s not up front  it’s by the back door effect they would tell you there isn’t any technical information only factory documents which are not for general release. So either you attempt a service knowing there are no spares  or documents available and should you. Cock it up back to the factory I goes. 

[Razz]

I don't see why the knock on mechanical watches. All watches are technically non essential with the advent of cell phones. In some ways you could say there is less use for high end quartz watches as they are just Jewellry without the mechanical workings draw.