Waltham 365

[Murks]

Hi I'm working on this waltham 365 model I'm trying to poise the balance wheel but a notice it not even moving on the poising tool a also notice one side of balance wheel has two screws missing my question was a have few screws for balance wheel but none fit into the thread balance screw hole does it have to be a particular screw for this movement?

Edited June 26, 2024 by Murks

[oldhippy]

You need the same number of screws on both sides and they must be the same that means weight, length and thread. 

[Murks]

Thanks oldhippy does cousinuk sale any  this don't the just sale assortments does any one who could sale this?

[JohnR725]

It's unlikely that cousins would have any screws at all that would fit. Unfortunately especially for vintage watches they did not have a standards. So typically the American watch company screws will only fit other American watch company parts. So you'd ideally need a assortment of American balance wheels to look for screws.

Then the several things were replacing the missing screws you have to replace a pair of them as they have to exactly match. Also for timekeeping are we missing screws or they just rearranged in some silly fashion? You have to have the right quantity of screws for that balance wheel and hairspring if the watches going to keep time.

Then I circled something in the picture notice how two of the screws are different? I also found an image of another watch off of eBay which a paste the image below those are timing adjustment screws or mean time screws they are and never adjusted in tight. There supposed to be out some distance to allow you to fine adjust the watch. Oh they want to be really careful of these the threads on them are different than the rest of the balance screws and they don't like to be played with otherwise they get loose there a carefully designed so they can be out without turning all by themselves.

 

[mikepilk]

I think you best bet @Murks would be to buy old scrap Waltham movements and use parts from those.

[nevenbekriev]

Hi Murks,

You can get one of the screws from one side and put it on the other.

You say the balance doesn't even move on the poising tool, are the pivots OK?

Edited June 26, 2024 by nevenbekriev

[Murks]

Yes the pivots are OK have now added weight on what side and this is what I'm getting now can you let me know if this is poised 

[RichardHarris123]

Is it the light or is this pivot bent?

[JohnR725]

Unfortunately poise cannot be determined by looking at still images we would need a video.

If you give the balance wheel a Porsche so it rotates it must rotate and come to a stop without rocking backwards and forwards. At least if you are in school for absolute perfection that's what would happen it would just roll along and come to a stop. Oh and the jewels on the tool have to be spotlessly clean and so to the pivots. In real life the balance wheel comes to a stop they can still rock back and forth very slowly and you're going to be reasonably close. But you really need to see a video or we need to see the video of how the balance wheel looks on the tool

For instance in this YouTube video he gives the balance wheel is gentle puff of air that rotates and comes to a stop no rocking back and forth at all.

Now in this video he shows the importance of leveling the tool but even though often times the level is in the base ideally the level should be removable and placed on the jaws themselves because sometimes the jaws are not level with the base. But usually I find with my tool is as close enough but if you're really perfect about it the level supposed to be removable

Then he simulates and out of weight condition by removing a screw. Ill notice when he gives the balance wheel a Porsche it rotates but when it comes to a stop it aggressively rocks backwards and forwards. Whereas if it's reasonably close it will still rock backwards and forwards but it will be very very slowly

So really only with a video can we tell

 

2 minutes ago, RichardHarris123 said:

Is it the light or is this pivot bent?

Let's hope that's an optical illusion because of it is bent it will totally screw up poising as that will take control over the whole issue and make poising a waste of time.