How do I remove the date function from a movement?

[Microbrandowner]

Need some guidance - how do we modify a Sellita SW200 movement with date, into one without a date? I know the calendar disc has to be removed, and the crown setting lever jumper has to be changed. Are there other parts that need to be removed so the modification is "clean" and doesn't cause any future issues?

PS: I posted this in the parts forum and realised that perhaps the question or the forum wasn't right.

https://www.watchrepairtalk.com/topic/30341-change-sw200-1-date-to-sw200-1-no-date-what-parts-need-to-go/#comment-258041

 

[Nucejoe]

 SW200-1b     has no date complication, perhaps best would be to buy one, it will answer all your question. 

Rgds

[Geotex]

With a two-position setting lever installed, you should be able to remove the rest of the springs, wheels, jumpers, etc. that are part of the calendar works to remove unnecessary parts that would drain power and could jam up even if spinning unseen.  However, you said in the other post that you were retrofitting these to work with some existing no-date dials and cases. Those will need to be checked for proper fit, since the dimensions on calendar movements can be different due to the extras on top, affecting things such as the dial to stem spacing, hour wheel  height, correct movement ring thickness, etc. and these incompatibilities will remain even with date parts removed.

[Neverenoughwatches]

20 minutes ago, Geotex said:

With a two-position setting lever installed, you should be able to remove the rest of the springs, wheels, jumpers, etc. that are part of the calendar works to remove unnecessary parts that would drain power and could jam up even if spinning unseen.  However, you said in the other post that you were retrofitting these to work with some existing no-date dials and cases. Those will need to be checked for proper fit, since the dimensions on calendar movements can be different due to the extras on top, affecting things such as the dial to stem spacing, hour wheel  height, correct movement ring thickness, etc. and these incompatibilities will remain even with date parts removed.

 

20 minutes ago, Geotex said:

With a two-position setting lever installed, you should be able to remove the rest of the springs, wheels, jumpers, etc. that are part of the calendar works to remove unnecessary parts that would drain power and could jam up even if spinning unseen.  However, you said in the other post that you were retrofitting these to work with some existing no-date dials and cases. Those will need to be checked for proper fit, since the dimensions on calendar movements can be different due to the extras on top, affecting things such as the dial to stem spacing, hour wheel  height, correct movement ring thickness, etc. and these incompatibilities will remain even with date parts removed.

Funny how one can make it sound like a simple affair and then someone else can.............kind of not. Lol

4 hours ago, Microbrandowner said:

Need some guidance - how do we modify a Sellita SW200 movement with date, into one without a date? I know the calendar disc has to be removed, and the crown setting lever jumper has to be changed. Are there other parts that need to be removed so the modification is "clean" and doesn't cause any future issues?

PS: I posted this in the parts forum and realised that perhaps the question or the forum wasn't right.

https://www.watchrepairtalk.com/topic/30341-change-sw200-1-date-to-sw200-1-no-date-what-parts-need-to-go/#comment-258041

 

After reading joe's and geotex's comments, it makes more financial and reputable sense to just save those for date watches and buy the appropriate non-date version movements required.  Makes no sense to cause yourself a headache now and a potentially bigger one further in the future. It may actually be a recognised and acceptable modification but why take chances. My trade is different but the same principles apply, make it right first time and you only make it once. Happy customer means happy business

I'm not a watchmaker and never will be in the true sense of the word. I think I'd make a good apprentice and with luck one day be a good amateur maybe even part-time professional with the odd qualification.  At 57 i am a pro in my trade with 40 years of experience of it and a businessman with 37 years experience with past success but winding down now, trademen with physical jobs can only last so long.   To build a reputable business you need principles and methodology that you stand by while working. It takes time and a lot of effort to build a reputation, stick to good principles that you set for yourself af the start and your reputation will grow. There's a saying here in Yorkshire " you're only as good as your last job "  and its absolutely true. People risk their own character when recommending , for some it can be like recommending themselves. I rarely do it for others. So that follows that good reputations take time to grow. Those same people that are slow to recommend only need to blink to generate critism, that follows that criticism can dent and destroy a reputation.  Get it right , get it right and keep getting it right.

Rich.

[spectre6000]

I literally just did this a few weeks ago with my own DD. You remove the associated parts, swap out the set lever spring to the two detent variety, then crack a beer cause you're done.

[Microbrandowner]

19 hours ago, Geotex said:

you should be able to remove the rest of the springs, wheels, jumpers, etc. that are part of the calendar works to remove unnecessary parts that would drain power and could jam up even if spinning unseen

@Geotex are you able to specifically list the parts that will have to be removed with part numbers for the SW200-1? I will contact the manufacturer nevetheless.

44 minutes ago, spectre6000 said:

You remove the associated parts,

Can you please specify the parts that have to go?

[Neverenoughwatches]

12 minutes ago, Microbrandowner said:

@Geotex are you able to specifically list the parts that will have to be removed with part numbers for the SW200-1? I will contact the manufacturer nevetheless.

Can you please specify the parts that have to go?

The manufacturer would be able to detail what is required to remove and replace. Do you buy direct from Sellita ?

19 hours ago, Nucejoe said:

 SW200-1b     has no date complication, perhaps best would be to buy one, it will answer all your question. 

Rgds

Simple answer to a simple answer problem Joe  . You're the man

[watchweasol]

Hi unless you made a bo bo and got the wrong version I would be inclined to follow Joes advice and get the one without the complication.  If you buy direct from Sellita you should be able to get the technical sheets for all the versions and update bulletins.

[Neverenoughwatches]

16 minutes ago, watchweasol said:

Hi unless you made a bo bo and got the wrong version I would be inclined to follow Joes advice and get the one without the complication.  If you buy direct from Sellita you should be able to get the technical sheets for all the versions and update bulletins.

I know we all carry out the occasional dodgy bodge mod to get over a problem. But thats usually on something old or unobtainable or an expensive part. I was looking at the prices of some Rolex setting levers the other day ( £100 +) , the pullout piece type, such a simple part to make. Yeah we do that out of necessity normally, with a paying customer , i know i wouldnt be happy if i discovered a new watch that i bought had been modded without notifying me, personally i would feel like I'd been duped.

Edited August 16, 2024 by Neverenoughwatches

[Nucejoe]

20 hours ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

After reading joe's and geotex's comments, it makes more financial and reputable sense to just save those for date watches and buy the appropriate non-date version movements required.  Makes no sense to cause yourself a headache now and a potentially bigger one further in the future. It may actually be a recognised and acceptable modification but why take chances. My trade is different but the same principles apply, make it right first time and you only make it once. Happy customer means happy business

I'm not a watchmaker and never will be in the true sense of the word. I think I'd make a good apprentice and with luck one day be a good amateur maybe even part-time professional with the odd qualification.  At 57 i am a pro in my trade with 40 years of experience of it and a businessman with 37 years experience with past success but winding down now, trademen with physical jobs can only last so long.   To build a reputable business you need principles and methodology that you stand by while working. It takes time and a lot of effort to build a reputation, stick to good principles that you set for yourself af the start and your reputation will grow. There's a saying here in Yorkshire " you're only as good as your last job "  and its absolutely true. People risk their own character when recommending , for some it can be like recommending themselves. I rarely do it for others. So that follows that good reputations take time to grow. Those same people that are slow to recommend only need to blink to generate critism, that follows that criticism can dent and destroy a reputation.  Get it right , get it right and keep getting it right.

Rich.

Wow, matey. 

  Your words are worth gold.

Edited August 16, 2024 by Nucejoe
Edit

[Neverenoughwatches]

22 minutes ago, Nucejoe said:

Wow, matey. 

  Your words are worth gold.

Experience just from dealing with thousands of the general public. You quickly become a good judge of character when folks are about to owe you money, i haven't had a problem in over 30 years because i care. It may not sound like i do sometimes but i actually do . 

Haha its called tough love and i excell at dishing it out.

[VWatchie]

On 8/15/2024 at 8:32 PM, Neverenoughwatches said:

My trade is different but the same principles apply, make it right first time and you only make it once. Happy customer means happy business

Amen!

On 8/15/2024 at 8:32 PM, Neverenoughwatches said:

There's a saying here in Yorkshire " you're only as good as your last job "  and its absolutely true.

I say that's not only true in Yorkshire but universally true. Great post!

19 hours ago, watchweasol said:

If you buy direct from Sellita you should be able to get the technical sheets for all the versions and update bulletins.

I am not sure what you are referring to but I think most, if not all, of it is freely available on their site. I am extremely happy that we have Sellita selling movements and parts to anyone who wants them without any restrictions. To those who ask, I always recommend watches that use Sellita movements and stay away from any brand from the Swatch group (Tissot, Omega, Longines, etc.)

19 hours ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

i know i wouldnt be happy if i discovered a new watch that i bought had been modded without notifying me, personally i would feel like I'd been duped.

That's a very good, but not so obvious point! People who buy mechanical watches often do so because they care about the technology behind them. Yes, I'd feel duped too unless it had been disclosed.

[Neverenoughwatches]

14 minutes ago, VWatchie said:

am not sure what you are referring to but I think most, if not all, of it is freely available on their site. I am extremely happy that we have Sellita selling movements and parts to anyone who wants them without any restrictions. To those who ask, I always recommend watches that use Sellita movements and stay away from any brand from the Swatch group (Tissot, Omega, Longines, etc.)

I read something few days ago, so this maybe an idea for all of us to do, but sign up for an account with them ( not sure if criteria dependent) and you have online spec access. 

I think its more detailed than what you have here H

27 minutes ago, VWatchie said:

I say that's not only true in Yorkshire but universally true. Great post!

It certainly is H,  it can take a long time for people to trust us and the moment we slip up, even accidently,that trust can disappear, thats just human nature.   I try to appreciate that everyone has their faults , those faults also make us what we are as much as our strengths do.  Genuine folk come back and recover from slip ups and learn from them whereas less genuine folk make the same mistakes time and time again.

[VWatchie]

18 minutes ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

sign up for an account with them

https://www.sellita.ch/index.php/en/customer-service#

[Neverenoughwatches]

1 minute ago, VWatchie said:

https://www.sellita.ch/index.php/en/customer-service#

Yep thats what i read H , you're  on fire today matey

Only sticking point i can see is completing the form for non vat registered  there doesn't look to be an option for it.  We can all make up a watch company name, i did this for my cousins account, this cant be checked with UK's HMRC but anyone if vat registered this can be viewed with companies house. I assume other countries will have similar registrations.

[VWatchie]

12 minutes ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

Yep thats what i read H , you're  on fire today matey

Back from holiday! 

[Neverenoughwatches]

At the end of the day anyone can start a business and register it, watch repair or otherwise, that business doesnt have to make a profit or a loss, I'm fairly sure it doesn't even have to be operating year on year but its probably a good idea to put something through even just a repair for a friend once a year. Tax return forms with something like this with little expenditure ( haha yes i know good joke, who's want to let Bergeon in on that one ) take minutes to complete. But nevertheless a legally minimal operating business can open doors to other companies. 

3 minutes ago, VWatchie said:

Back from holiday! 

Haha all fired up and ready to enter your watchcave .

[spectre6000]

On 8/16/2024 at 7:30 AM, Microbrandowner said:

Can you please specify the parts that have to go?

I don't know part numbers or anything like that off the top of my head, but I happen to have the baggie of takeoffs in the drawer under my right elbow.

Look at the way the energy is transferred from the date wheel backward. I'm sure there are plenty of tutorials out there, but at the end of the day, just follow the energy pathway, and make sure you're not affecting any other subsystem. The plate with the attached wheel (and its screw to the top left) holds, IIRC, the larger wheel down, which is what reduces from the hour wheel probably. The top piece is the jumper spring that holds the date wheel in place until it's time to flip over. The smaller wheel is what actually flips the date wheel over a notch. The big washed out spring at the bottom is the 3-position that gets removed and replace with a 2-position spring to eliminate the middle date set position. The dial side of the movement isn't especially busy, so this should hopefully make it pretty clear.

@Microbrandowner, As a fellow startup guy and entrepreneur, these guys aren't wrong about sourcing the dateless movement... once you are actually in production. Prototype phases and all sorts of other things can necessitate something like this activity all manner of different ways. I get that. Sometimes it's just part of the thinking process too, and you gotta work through things. Hope this helps.

Edited August 17, 2024 by spectre6000

[watchweasol]

HI. I get your drift, this is a development phase to gauge reaction to the model without complication. So sooner than shell out for the non complication version you are wanting to use what you have already.    Sensible.     If you are a registered company  using Sellita movements it would make sense to open an account , as it seems that once done you have full access to parts and data hopefully the full blown technical documents, ie   Exploded diagrams, oiling sheets , parts sheets. Etc.

Hi @Neverenoughwatches  that’s what I was alluding to in the previous post. 

 

[Gula67]

That section with red mark have to remove and the date indicator. Also that wheel for the quick set what is at the date 5. That's all...and change the setting lever,if the double click/pull bother you.

[Neverenoughwatches]

29 minutes ago, watchweasol said:

HI. I get your drift, this is a development phase to gauge reaction to the model without complication. So sooner than shell out for the non complication version you are wanting to use what you have already.    Sensible.     If you are a registered company  using Sellita movements it would make sense to open an account , as it seems that once done you have full access to parts and data hopefully the full blown technical documents, ie   Exploded diagrams, oiling sheets , parts sheets. Etc.

Hi @Neverenoughwatches  that’s what I was alluding to in the previous post. 

 

Makes sense ww, if its for a few customers maybe i can see that but obviously not to continuously mod for an an alternative choice. I guess a lot depends on the stock that you have mounted and how much cash you have to reorder dateless versions. 

1 hour ago, spectre6000 said:

I don't know part numbers or anything like that off the top of my head, but I happen to have the baggie of takeoffs in the drawer under my right elbow.

Look at the way the energy is transferred from the date wheel backward. I'm sure there are plenty of tutorials out there, but at the end of the day, just follow the energy pathway, and make sure you're not affecting any other subsystem. The plate with the attached wheel (and its screw to the top left) holds, IIRC, the larger wheel down, which is what reduces from the hour wheel probably. The top piece is the jumper spring that holds the date wheel in place until it's time to flip over. The smaller wheel is what actually flips the date wheel over a notch. The big washed out spring at the bottom is the 3-position that gets removed and replace with a 2-position spring to eliminate the middle date set position. The dial side of the movement isn't especially busy, so this should hopefully make it pretty clear.

@Microbrandowner, As a fellow startup guy and entrepreneur, these guys aren't wrong about sourcing the dateless movement... once you are actually in production. Prototype phases and all sorts of other things can necessitate something like this activity all manner of different ways. I get that. Sometimes it's just part of the thinking process too, and you gotta work through things. Hope this helps.

Still its a lesson spectre , all lessons are valuable.