Dial feet soldering machine

[PaulRepairShop]

Recently I bought a dial feet soldering machine (complete kit with all materials and the machine itself with spare carbon tip).

The machine should be helpfull in soldering new dial feet the a brass dial. In doing so I noticed the little chips of solder only flow to the new dial feet and not onto the dial itself.

The brass dial and feet are well cleaned to the bare metal and flux is added together with the small chips. When rubbing with the carbon tip to the new dial feet, the solder immedialely flows onto the dial feet, but not flowing to the surface of the dial itself. It seems that the current (many sparks are noticed between carbon and dial feet) which is produced is strong enough for the solder to flow, but not enough to flow on the dial also.

Has anyone have expirience with a dial feet soldering machine?

[Paul80]

Sounds like not enough current, what machine are you using.

[AndyGSi]

What machine and where in relation to the dial foot is the second contact as @Paul80 has said it sounds like insufficient current.

[PaulRepairShop]

The machine is from Watchlume.com. See pictures. The dial itself is screwed on the little bolt and the new dial foot is held and pressed onto the dial by the lever above. The current is flowing from the carbon tip, held against the new foot, via the new foot and through the dial.

[MikeEll]

there's a good Chronoglide video on Youtube covering this technique in detail

 

Edited December 2, 2024 by MikeEll

[praezis]

I don‘t use such device but:

This is soldering. The coal rod is a heat source. You heat the foot wire, but the dial plate is a big heat sink that draws heat from the tiny wire without getting hot enough  itself. For the solder to flow and connect both, both wire and plate must reach about 250 deg C. In your case the dial stays cold, only the wire is hot enough to make the solder flow.

Frank

[HectorLooi]

Instead of solder chips, try using low fusing solder paste. Although I have a similar carbon rod soldering machine, I prefer to use a microtorch to do dial feet soldering.

From my experience, brass wire and brass dial feet do not work. It has to be copper for good heat conduction. I use a 0.8mm copper wire as my dial feet. Some downward pressure on the copper wire must be applied so that there is good contact for heat to conduct to the brass dial. Heat the wire about 1.0cm above the dial surface and let the heat travel down the copper wire and melt the solder paste. The heat will conduct down to the dial and solder will flow. All this happens quite quickly, so watch carefully.

Practice on some old dials first, for you are definitely going to scorch a few dials before you get the hang of it.

[nickelsilver]

I haven't messed with one of these machines very much, but I agree with Hector, copper is the way to go for the feet. I tried German silver and brass, both terrible, while copper was almost a guarantee of success.

[AndyGSi]

I think looking at your machine the problem is the lack of contact between the carbon rod and the dial foot.

All the others I've seen have a custom collet depending on the size of the foots peg that makes contact with the disc on the foot, not just the very tip of the peg.

You could try drilling a hole in the end of the carbon rod to get the same result.

[RichardHarris123]

Many years ago I was a plumber, I think the same principle applies, heat unit the solder melts, then immediately withdraw the heat. 

[AndyGSi]

28 minutes ago, RichardHarris123 said:

Many years ago I was a plumber, I think the same principle applies, heat unit the solder melts, then immediately withdraw the heat. 

The principal with these is more along the lines of spot welding where you get the instant heat that quickly dissipates to prevent damage to the dial.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005004270437207.html

[Neverenoughwatches]

4 hours ago, HectorLooi said:

Instead of solder chips, try using low fusing solder paste. Although I have a similar carbon rod soldering machine, I prefer to use a microtorch to do dial feet soldering.

From my experience, brass wire and brass dial feet do not work. It has to be copper for good heat conduction. I use a 0.8mm copper wire as my dial feet. Some downward pressure on the copper wire must be applied so that there is good contact for heat to conduct to the brass dial. Heat the wire about 1.0cm above the dial surface and let the heat travel down the copper wire and melt the solder paste. The heat will conduct down to the dial and solder will flow. All this happens quite quickly, so watch carefully.

Practice on some old dials first, for you are definitely going to scorch a few dials before you get the hang of it.

This is the same method that I use, and find it easy to do using Bismuth low melt solder.  The heat can be seen travelling down the wire, so you can gauge just when the heat reaches the solder and dial.

[GPrideaux]

I'm having difficulty with soldering new copper dial feet. The copper gets hot and the solder melts but only bonds to the copper wire, not to the brass dial. I've viewed the Chronoglide video and I think I'm doing everything done there, but not getting good results. I can do it with a soldering iron on the dial, but that invariably scorches the dial itself.

@Neverenoughwatches where do you source Bismuth low melt solder paste? Do you use a small kitchen torch or one designed for the job?

[HectorLooi]

What type of solder are you using?

[GPrideaux]

I've recently received some Tix solder wire https://tixsolder.com/products/tix-solder which is supposed to be low (138ºC) melting point which I used today for the first time (with flux gel). Previously I've attempted it with the 60/40 tin lead rosin cored solder that I use for electronics. I didn't find much difference between the Tix and the standard 60/40 ... if anything it seemed less willing to wet the surfaces.

[HectorLooi]

Try a low fusing solder paste. The flow is much better.

[Neverenoughwatches]

4 hours ago, GPrideaux said:

I'm having difficulty with soldering new copper dial feet. The copper gets hot and the solder melts but only bonds to the copper wire, not to the brass dial. I've viewed the Chronoglide video and I think I'm doing everything done there, but not getting good results. I can do it with a soldering iron on the dial, but that invariably scorches the dial itself.

@Neverenoughwatches where do you source Bismuth low melt solder paste? Do you use a small kitchen torch or one designed for the job?

So any soldering need to have a clean surface to bond properly.  Use wirewool or fine wet and dry on the dial where the joint is to be had. Add a small amount of flux...for belt and braces I use a self cleaning flux as well. For the torch I use a small gas powered soldering iron , a creme brulee torch might be overkill, you might even get away with a lighter ?  This is the bismuth paste I use, just cheap bought off the net. I've had mine kept in the fridge for three years, just tried it and its still soft like it was when I bought it.

[GPrideaux]

Thanks. I'll get some solder paste and a butane lighter and practice some more. I have a butane soldering iron that I can use as a hot air gun, but it's hard to see exactly what I'm heating with that.

Should I tin the wire first, or just clean it and the dial with some 400 grit paper before applying the solder paste?

 

 

[Neverenoughwatches]

37 minutes ago, GPrideaux said:

Thanks. I'll get some solder paste and a butane lighter and practice some more. I have a butane soldering iron that I can use as a hot air gun, but it's hard to see exactly what I'm heating with that.

Should I tin the wire first, or just clean it and the dial with some 400 grit paper before applying the solder paste?

 

 

So I do have one of the Bergeon dial foot soldering devices, fortunately it was cheap( they usually are not ), its convenient but totally unnecessary, as you can knock up something quite simple yourself. I don’t tin the wire,but i don't see why that wouldn't work ok. My method i think is the same as Hector's.....I mark up the center position of the wire on the dial with a round burr first before I clean up the dial...otherwise you lose the positioning..then you have to guess. I then cut a 2 inch length of 0.7mm copper wire, set its position on the dial and add some bismuth paste to the join. Heat the top of the wire and watch the heat travel down the wire to the solder. Its easy control the heat adding and removing it to the wire as required,  keeping a close eye on the solder.