How to handle unconventional attachment of the second hand?

[Knebo]

4 minutes ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

It kinda makes you feel like you're making an effort to stay healthy

The time I owned one, it primarily reminded me that I was burning money instead of calories. 

[Neverenoughwatches]

4 minutes ago, Knebo said:

The time I owned one, it primarily reminded me that I was burning money instead of calories. 

Haha you do actually have to visit once in a while.

6 hours ago, VWatchie said:

hope it isn’t glued or permanently attached to the pivot. 

That would seem like a crazy idea, but this is watchmaking I guess. Stops folk servicing their own watches. 

1 hour ago, tomh207 said:

I and a couple of friends once toyed with the idea of opening a bar called “The Gym”

Haha the perfect alibi. " Honey , I'm just off to -The Gym- for a couple of hours with the lads"  " oo come back all fit and pumped for me darling "   " er.. hmm...yeah..I'll try " 

[VWatchie]

5 hours ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

Have you got an old credit card that you can drill a hole into or push a pin through and drop the card over the cannon pin.

Thank you for the tip, R  It came at just the right time since I was just wondering what kind of plastic piece I could use. Just to be safe, I think I'll go with my wife's credit card.

Unfortunately, I've always been bad at improvising, and perhaps that shows all too clearly to those who are perceptive. What else made you suggest so many different types of cards!?  Regardless, I’m very grateful for the suggestion! 

It is indeed New Year's Eve tomorrow (or actually already), but hopefully, I'll have time to make an attempt before the champagne bottle is opened.

2 hours ago, Knebo said:

Wouldn't that further compress the tube against the pivot, making it even harder to remove?

Good thinking! Credit card and hand levers it is!

Edited December 30, 2024 by VWatchie

[Neverenoughwatches]

40 years of working in the construction industry you learn to improvise, make-do, use whatever you have and think on your feet. Construction involves the use of so many different materials, often its a case of which material suits the job best. I'm waiting for the day I can use concrete in a watch ...a dail maybe . Usually a quick look around your environment will provide your needs, 2 days ago I used one of my mother in- laws table placement mats as a white board to sketch an idea for a watch part graining technique for MB to look at. Much to her annoyance and to my joy .

[Neverenoughwatches]

Well if you're going to p.iss someone off, it may as well be your mother in-law

Edited December 31, 2024 by Neverenoughwatches

[VWatchie]

Mission accomplished! 

I really can't thank you all enough for your help. WRT is all about this, and what a fantastic way to finish the year!

Before getting in there.

Two layers of my wife's card were required.

Ready for the operation.

Hand levers are ready to go. Not too much force applied and it snapped off with a slight click. 

Oh, that thing is tiny.

Zero damage to the pivot.

Wishing you all a truly Happy End of the Year and New Year!

[RichardHarris123]

Glad it worked out, happy new year to you too. 

What makes me laugh is the "Invalid until signed " almost impossible to write on. 

[Knebo]

22 minutes ago, VWatchie said:

Mission accomplished! 

I really can't thank you all enough for your help. WRT is all about this, and what a fantastic way to finish the year!

Before getting in there.

Two layers of my wife's card were required.

Ready for the operation.

Hand levers are ready to go. Not too much force applied and it snapped off with a slight click. 

Oh, that thing is tiny.

Zero damage to the pivot.

Wishing you all a truly Happy End of the Year and New Year!

Excellent! And beautifully documented. 

Happy new year! 

[Neverenoughwatches]

Yey well done " our kid " Happy New Year "H" x

20 minutes ago, RichardHarris123 said:

Glad it worked out, happy new year to you too. 

What makes me laugh is the "Invalid until signed " almost impossible to write on. 

I remember years ago before contactless and card machines when we had to sign a receipt for our goods and then the cashier would check our signed receipt signature against the one on our card that was used to produce the receipt so that they matched. I never used to sign my cards and once a cashier asked me to sign my card in front of her so she could check it against the receipt I had signed 5 seconds earlier.  " yes they both match thank you sir " 

Just googled the machine that did that, chunka chunk manual machines that the cashier swiped the credit card details over onto carbon copy paper that we signed.  Wow ! Blast from the past....late 80s

[GPrideaux]

Excellent! @VWatchie, please let us know how you get on riveting the second hand back on to the tube.

[VWatchie]

6 hours ago, GPrideaux said:

Excellent! @VWatchie, please let us know how you get on riveting the second hand back on to the tube.

Thank you! Will do! 

I used to worry about things I knew I would have to deal with sooner or later, but nowadays, I have learned to apply a principle that a highly valued colleague of mine often reminds me of. It has proven to work fantastically well and beyond expectations in all sorts of situations:

"Attack exactly one problem at a time!"

 

Edited January 1 by VWatchie

[VWatchie]

As the proverbs say, "necessity is the mother of invention" and "where there is a will, there is a way."

After much thought and several failed strategies and attempts, I finally managed to figure out and carry out the mounting or riveting of the second hand. As I mentioned earlier, I don't consider myself particularly skilled when thinking outside the box (and thus probably one of Bergeon's best amateur customers), but practice makes perfect, so I can't help but feel a little proud today  OK, it's not rocket science, but still.

I placed the second-hand tube into the hole of a suitable pusher from my jewelling tool. To work under my stereo microscope, I placed the pusher in a hole in a wooden block. Without the stereo microscope, the operation would have been impossible, at least for me. Then, I manipulated the second hand with two brass tweezers until the hexagonal hole in the hand aligned with the hexagonal top of the tube and gently pressed the hand, hoping it would attach well enough not to fall off. Fortunately, I got the hand to attach, albeit slightly crooked and very loosely.

After this, I very carefully transferred the pusher to the jewelling tool so the hand wouldn’t fall off in the process. I had pre-set the micrometre to minimize the risk of crushing or damaging the hand if it became necessary to apply relatively high force on the jewelling tool lever.

Finally, I carefully lowered the lever, and almost immediately, without applying much force at all, the second hand clicked into place. It was a distinct click—the kind that gives you a satisfying feeling in your body.

My only concern was that the tube or hand might have been damaged when I removed them, causing the hand to spin freely on the tube. Luckily, my concern proved unfounded, and the hand fit perfectly onto the tube. Now, all that remains is to press the tube onto the fourth wheel’s pivot when the time comes.

Edited January 4 by VWatchie

[Neverenoughwatches]

1 hour ago, VWatchie said:

Finally, I carefully lowered the lever, and almost immediately, without applying much force at all, the second hand clicked into place. It was a distinct click—the kind that gives you a satisfying feeling in your body.

This seems like the tube is split into sections with a rim, making the end spring loaded  ?  Or the end of the tube did in fact have sprung tabs that lock over hole once it's pressed on. Any chance of a clear macro shot of the tube end H

[VWatchie]

5 hours ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

Or the end of the tube did in fact have sprung tabs that lock over hole once it's pressed on.

That's what I believe but on this scale not even my stereo scope is magnification enough to reveal all the details. Anyway, it's a solid fit so I'm more than happy.

5 hours ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

Any chance of a clear macro shot of the tube end H

The ones I published before are as close as I can get so I'm afraid not. I believe that tube is some of the tiniest pieces I've ever handled, except perhaps for the dreaded Seiko Diafix springs for the escape wheel.

[RickTock]

Nicely done!

[VWatchie]

So, this project is finally complete, and to wrap up this thread, here’s a brief description of how I reattached the second hand to the fourth wheel pivot.

Normally, I just press the second hand on, but this time, I thought it would require quite a bit of force since it was firmly in place when I removed it. I figured that if I didn’t manage to push the hand down far enough, it would end up touching the underside of the crystal.

Keeping this in mind, I realized there was a significant risk of disturbing the jewel on the barrel bridge—or, in the worst case, even pushing it out. My first thought was to order a movement holder with hand-setting support, but impatience and budget constraints put an end to that idea.

Instead, I used my Seitz jewelling tool in screw press mode to support the jewel properly. Initially, I was a bit worried that I wouldn’t be able to keep the movement level enough, but fortunately, that concern turned out to be unfounded. When the pressure becomes high enough, the movement naturally settles into a flat position—just like when adjusting end-shake on a jewel. Isn’t it amazing how versatile a jewelling tool can be!?

Looking back, I think I could have just pressed the second hand back on without supporting the jewel, but at least I’ve gained some experience from it.

Here’s a picture of my freshly serviced "Royal Oak." More pictures are available here if anyone is interested.

 

[Jon]

On 1/4/2025 at 2:24 PM, VWatchie said:

My only concern was that the tube or hand might have been damaged when I removed them, causing the hand to spin freely on the tube.

Once the hand is fitted back on the pipe it helps to rivet it to make sure it doesn't detach or move

[Paul80]

I had exactly the same issue when I tried removing the hands from a TAG I was servicing as a favour, didn't have VWatchie's luck or was is skill in getting it back together, ended up costing me £120 for a new set of hands.

So much for doing someone a favour.

Shan't be doing that again.

[Knebo]

Well done and thanks for sharing! 

I'm always happy when I see the Seitz in micrometer-screw-mode. I feel that many people don't know about it.