New balance staff slightly different

[Khan]

The roller with impulse jewel sits a little loose on the new balance staff, even if I ordered a staff for exact same calibre. Can I do anything about it? 

[AndyGSi]

Are yo sure you've ordered the correct one as the new staff on the right looks way too short to start with.

[Khan]

I hope so.

I ordered this one. My calibre is a Pierce 103 without incabloc. 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/192680125499

Edited January 14 by Khan

[AndyGSi]

So are you sure it's a 103 and how does the balance fit as the shoulder also looks a lot smaller than the original.

[Neverenoughwatches]

48 minutes ago, Khan said:

The roller with impulse jewel sits a little loose on the new balance staff, even if I ordered a staff for exact same calibre. Can I do anything about it? 

35 minutes ago, Khan said:

I hope so.

I ordered this one. My calibre is a Pierce 103 without incabloc. 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/192680125499

 

Do you have .43mm for the roller ?

Edited January 14 by Neverenoughwatches

[Khan]

I use this tool to measure, might not be the most precise. What tool should I measure with by the way? 

But it says 0,40 for the new staff and 0,405-0,410 for the old when I measure the thickness of the staff where the roller should be fitted. 

I see now the arbor is also too slim to fit in the balance wheel hole. So its totally wrong and useless. 

Edited January 14 by Khan

[caseback]

0.1mm per division is far too inaccurate for watchmaking. You'd at least need a 0,01 accuracy. A feintaster would be nice, but they are often very expensive. A thickness gauge (analogue or digital) with a 0,01 accuracy is a low cost alternative.

You could use a screw type micrometer as well, but care should be taken not to damage your part.

Edited January 14 by caseback

[AndyGSi]

So from what you've said it would appear you haven't got a pierce 103 so photos of the movement may help confirm this.

You need to be using at least a pair of digital calipers to get some sort of accuracy.

[Khan]

Thats the movement. Pierce 103, it has this extra wheel on top so not a basic 103. It looks to also be called 103cld

[nevenbekriev]

You can use some thread locker to fix the roller table in place, if this is the main problem.

How the balance fits on the seat? It is clearly seen that the old staff is just punched out, and that the rivet on it is spread a lot. Now expected that the hole is too large and will wobble on the seat. 

[Neverenoughwatches]

6 hours ago, Khan said:

Thats the movement. Pierce 103, it has this extra wheel on top so not a basic 103. It looks to also be called 103cld

Thats just the drive wheel for the sweep pinion

The caliber is also listed as a moon phase triple calendar 

[Khan]

Yeah my bad that I used staking tool to punch out the old staff. I dont have a platax tool unfortunately. 

Yes, its a moonphase calender watch. 

I see its better to replace the whole balance. Do you guys think this one will fit on page 12? 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/275331810162

My picture attached is my balance wheel from before. 

Edited January 15 by Khan

[Neverenoughwatches]

Punching out the staff always has that chance of deforming the hole, widening the hole. Using a Platax is just a safer way of punching out the staff, from what I understand of the tool it's more to do with not bending the balance arms, the hole is still at the same risk. Punching a tight fitting riveted piece of steel through a non steel hole....surely has consequences...maybe not first time but subsequent multiple times. 

[nevenbekriev]

But what is the case with the new staff and the balance? How much is the hole larger?

[Khan]

I ordered a new balance and cross fingers it will work that way

[Khan]

It works with the new nos balance! 

I though had to turn the hairspring in position to fit the bridge. The beat error is very high (roller jewel a bit off from the centre of balance "wings" but amplitude fine. How important is it to align the roller table? If so, I guess I have to diassemble the hairspring before taking off the roller table and personally dont want to mess too much with it. 

Edited January 26 by Khan

[GPrideaux]

Do you know how to adjust the beat error on a watch like this? It doesn't involve touching the roller, only turning the hairspring collet. See this excellent video (but don't worry about the first bit where he gets the impulse jewel in roughly the right position as yours is already there; just do the adjustment he shows in the second part of the video after putting the spring back in place):

BTW, you're not trying to do all this with the watch in its case, are you?

[Khan]

Yes I already did kind of what he does in end of the video. I first placed the balance (without the bridge of course) so it was aligned with the pallet fork. Then marked on the balance where the stud should be and then turned the hairspring.  My impulse jewel is just not exactly perpendicular to the wings of the balance, is that okay like that? 

Edited January 26 by Khan