NEed help finding click spring and caliber of unmrked movement.

[Arigato]

Hello community! Im J, finished level 3 or Mark's amazing lessons. 

I have spent the last few months practicing and working on different movements. 

I was working on a vintage watch today , unknown caliber, and after cleaning, re-assembling and oiling I was about to install the click spring, its was already off the movement for some reason when I took the caseback so I didnt get a. chance to see how it was installed. Despite not having figured out how it had to be installed, after a long time trying different positions and almost loosing the click spring 2-3 times it then decided to fly into the abyss. Looked everywhere, this apartement in Europe has 4mm space between wood floor lats so it might have ended up there. 

 

I am trying to find a replacement click spring or worst case a non working movement for parts. I havent had any chances yet with my resear and there is no markings on the movement. Ill sahre a few photos in hopes someone has more knowledge than me and wouldnt mind helping a fellow beginner. 

 

The click spring has one side up( Or down) and one sideways. 

 

Thank you for your time. 

 

Oh and also I would like to change the mainspring so I guess ill have to measure it with a caliper ( which i dont have yet) I was able to put it back by hand but was no fun lol.

 

 

[Arigato]

Looks liek a Felsa 161 ? but the Yoke spring is not visible on the Felsa. 161

[AndyGSi]

Welcome to the forum.

What size is it?

[RichardHarris123]

Hello and welcome from Leeds, England. The blue connects to the plate, the green acts against click. 

[mikepilk]

If we can identify the movement you might be able to buy a new click spring. Or, just buy a cheap selection and bend one to fit.

e.g from Cousins 

Click springs don't have to precise, you can usually bend one close enough to do the job.

[Nucejoe]

 Looks more like a Cortebert. Though Malnija 362 & 363 , copied  Cortebert, I doubt if Cyma sourced parts from Malnija.

 

 

 

 

 

[Arigato]

Thank you ! Measured with. atpe measurement ( no calipers yet ).  35mm just the movement and 40mm with the crown.  Everything i find that is very similar are all pocket watches.

thank you 

J

[Arigato]

Wow so much help. Thank you everyone. Reddit can be nasty sometimes and I am glad I found this Forum.

 

Mikepilk: Thats a great Idea, I assume it wont be that difficult with a delicate pair of pliers and its part of the hobby. 

RichardHarris123: Thank you and Hello from Germany. So on other movements I worked on the blue circle part normally goes in a small hole in the plate but this plate doesn't have a hole, was that what you were suggesting? Towards the end, before the click decided to fly away, i thought I had figured it out and the green part needed to be following the right side of the plate and the upward side needed to be between the two legs of the click if that makes any sense. I attached a terrible handmade drawing from my phone but im sure you will understand what I mean. 

Nucejoe: Thank you I will check this out right now. 

Edited March 22 by Arigato

[Arigato]

I am also realizing how this click needs to be put, and both legs needs to be in contact with the Ratchet whell, something I wasnt sure, so thats a step forward at least

[RichardHarris123]

Are you sure there's no hole. 

5 minutes ago, Arigato said:

normally goes in a small hole in the plate but this plate doesn't have a hole, was that what you were suggesting

It was what I was suggesting.  If there's no hole, it's the wrong spring. 

[watchweasol]

Hello and welcome to the forum, plenty of help offered .

[Arigato]

That could justify why by the love of god i couldnt figure out how to make it work. Hence trying to figure out a similar movement and compare which type of click spring would work and then buy a bunch like you suggested and make one that would fit. At least I got the watch running which is a win for me. There was oil all over the movement. I just moved from the US and Esslinger/Otto frei was great. Couins is great too but outside of the UK with the shipping I gotta make sure its worth it money wise. Im sure ill need more tools in the near future, its a endless acquiring process.

 

Again thank you so much for your time and input. 

 

 

[Neverenoughwatches]

If the dial is original to the watch, I'd be surprised if the movement wasn't made Cyma ( Tavannes) . When I got stuck for how something fitted or worked....I would start further up in the component sequence of that function group, to where I'd understand an operation, then work backwards from there to where I was stuck, figuring out each connection and interaction on the way. When you get back to the original confusion,things " click " into place mentally . 

The piece might be wrong or damaged,but you should see that more clearly now.

[mikepilk]

I can't see a match for the keyless works. The setting lever spring is very distinctive.

What is the diameter of the movement ?

 

[AndyGSi]

22 minutes ago, mikepilk said:

I can't see a match for the keyless works. The setting lever spring is very distinctive.

What is the diameter of the movement ?

I've been down the same route with no joy.

@Arigato says it's 35mm but that sounds too big to me.

[Neverenoughwatches]

1 hour ago, Arigato said:

That could justify why by the love of god i couldnt figure out how to make it work. Hence trying to figure out a similar movement and compare which type of click spring would work and then buy a bunch like you suggested and make one that would fit. At least I got the watch running which is a win for me. There was oil all over the movement. I just moved from the US and Esslinger/Otto frei was great. Couins is great too but outside of the UK with the shipping I gotta make sure its worth it money wise. Im sure ill need more tools in the near future, its a endless acquiring process.

 

Again thank you so much for your time and input. 

 

 

Jump forward a step from fitting the spring....do this by finding, first which way the ratchet wheel tensions up and then next how the click will lock into the ratchet wheel teeth to hold its position.  Once the click's orientation is decided now see how the spring makes its return action to the click. The spring pushes the click back into the ratchet wheel teeth. Knowing what components do makes it easier to see how they fit. Now you see how this forward stepping can bring sense to the confusion.  It's nice to know what the movement is  , but with a simple piece like this, you can make one up or alter another to make it fit. 

38 minutes ago, AndyGSi said:

I've been down the same route with no joy.

@Arigato says it's 35mm but that sounds too big to me.

Nothing in your Flume book Andy ???, 3 hole setting lever . 15 1/2  ligne, could be , looks like a pretty big wristwatch in the op's hand.

 

Edited March 22 by Neverenoughwatches

[AndyGSi]

1 hour ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

Nothing in your Flume book Andy ???, 3 hole setting lever . 15 1/2  ligne, could be , looks like a pretty big wristwatch in the op's hand.

Yes I've looked but couldn't find anything even similar.

[mbwatch]

4 hours ago, Arigato said:

Reddit can be nasty sometimes and I am glad I found this Forum.

Also, nobody on reddit knows anything! (or the few who do are not good communicators) You will get vastly better advice here.

[Arigato]

This issue is actually bringing some joy and excitement to figure it out with all your support. 

I am still figuring out how to reply to specific messages.

 

MIKEPILK : I will add another photo with a measurement tape showing 35mm movement without crown. I do not have a caliper yet.

Neverenoughwatches, thank you for sharing your approach at problem solving. This is the way to go. There is a lot of different parts or they function a little different from caliber to caliber so time will help. I have so many 1940+ vintage watches that I either acquired or my father in law use to collect them. A lot of LED watches as well which is less what I enjoy. Altho there is a great amount of them being mechanical so I will get to see all the different movements eventually. I was able to snatch some great chronographs also for restoration but this will be in a while. Until I get into a landeron hehe ill know how to creat a click spring.

 

Also sometimes the click spring goes under the ratchet wheel but ot in this case. since it was in the movement, but not at its place when I opened the caseback I assumed it was most likely the right part. 

 

WATCHWEASOL: Thanks mate ! 

 

 

[Neverenoughwatches]

23 minutes ago, Arigato said:

am still figuring out how to reply to specific messages

Click on and scroll to select the text you want to quote.

Its sometimes easier said than done

41 minutes ago, Arigato said:

Also sometimes the click spring goes under the ratchet wheel but ot in this case. since it was in the movement, but not at its place when I opened the caseback I assumed it was most likely the right part. 

Can we see the click in position please, we need to see how it fits the space and interacts with the ratchet wheel.

[mikepilk]

17 minutes ago, Neverenoughwatches said:

Click on and scroll to select the text you want to quote.

Its sometimes easier said than done

D'oh. After all the years I've been on here, I didn't know you could do that Rich 

I just selected 'Quote' at the bottom, and edited out what I didn't want. 

Anything else you hiding from me ?

Edited March 22 by mikepilk

[Neverenoughwatches]

36 minutes ago, mikepilk said:

Anything else you hiding from me ?

Lol, that's funny Mike. When I visit places on holiday , I like to explore my surroundings, get my bearings. I probably did the same when I joined the forum, I just like to know where everything is and how it all works. If I think of anything else I'll let you know