Phantom Problem With Watch...

[DJW]

I built a custom ordered wristwatch using a Hamilton 921 movement for a customer and shipped it off a couple of weeks ago.

 

A few days after it was delivered the customer emailed me saying the watch was running poorly and that the hands were not moving.

 

Of course I'm thinking "I" did something wrong building it! I asked more questions and was told it only runs dial down and does not run dial up. So I asked if he had dropped it and was told that it has had this problem since he received it.

 

Thinking it was damaged in shipping and now has a broken balance staff, I had him ship it back to me and I received it yesterday. I opened the box, gave it a wind and off it went! It runs in every position! I put it on my analyzer and the only noticeable difference in running is when running dial up the amplitude(280) is about 20 degrees lower that dial down(300). I checked the hole jewels for excessive oil, cleaned them and re-oiled and tested again. Still the same, but both positions run accurately. Probably a pivot friction issue, but nothing to seemingly cause it NOT to run....

 

I don't doubt that he had a problem with the watch, but I hesitate to send it back without exhausting all possible causes.

 

Any ideas on what else I should be checking, or how I should be inspecting it?

Thanks!

[Mark]

Do you have a watch winder? If so - it is useful to put the watch on there (even though it is not an automatic).

 

My watch winder, an Elma Cyclomat for up to 12 watches, is getting on a bit and has developed a certain amount of jerkiness (not smooth running) and I like that because it is a form of stress test on the watch. I put most of my completed watches on wether they are automatic or not and this can exasperate problems which cannot be detected when testing on the bench.

 

 

 

Just a thought for you.

[DJW]

Do you have a watch winder? If so - it is useful to put the watch on there (even though it is not an automatic).

 

My watch winder, an Elma Cyclomat for up to 12 watches, is getting on a bit and has developed a certain amount of jerkiness (not smooth running) and I like that because it is a form of stress test on the watch. I put most of my completed watches on wether they are automatic or not and this can exasperate problems which cannot be detected when testing on the bench.

 

 

 

Just a thought for you.

I know,  I do really need to get a winder to check in more real world conditions.

 

But, He did say though, it was as simple as setting the watch on a table, dial down, and it would run. When he turned the watch over to dial up and set it on the table, it would stop.

 

The first thing that popped into my mind was, Did he actually wind the watch when he received it? I did ask him to wind it fully. He said he did and the problem did not go away.

 

I may wear it around the house today just to keep a closer eye on it (with my Test Drive leather strap of course!)

[Mark]

The only thing that comes to mind would be how secure the movement is in the case. But then that would not make sense as it is not something you could easily miss.

 

It is a mystery! 

[Geo]

Is there any chance that he is trying to make out there is an issue when there is not, and working his way around to a refund?

[DJW]

No, I don't think so. I already offer a money back guarantee on all my custom builds.

[Geo]

No, I don't think so. I already offer a money back guarantee on all my custom builds.

Fingers crossed that you get to the bottom of the issue, I'm sure we're all curious.

[DJW]

I found the issue! I removed the balance to once again inspect it and the hole jewels. I again removed the cap jewels to pegwood the holes just in case I had missed something that was causing the balance to bind. after reassembling the movement, the balance would stop in the dial up position! What the @*%# ! I looked at everything to see what was touching to make it stop.....it was the center wheel! I checked for end shake and it was not excessive. I checked the balance cock and it had been indented on the bottom to raise it up a bit, presumably to give more clearance. Also the lower balance jewel did look a little high in the hole. I also looked at the pallet and noticed it was hitting low on the roller jewel.

 

Seems previously there was a repair was done to either the balance staff or lower hole jewel that cause the balance assembly to sit higher than normal. Instead of fixing the issue, the balance cock was indented in the bottom to raise it up, thus giving clearance to run.

 

I flattened the indentations, which lowered the cock. But, now the balance had no end shake. I pressed the lower jewel a tiny bit further down in the plate and Viola' ! it has acceptable clearance to run without touching.

 

I'm still not sure why It wasn't stopping when I first received it, but I'm sure that this was the cause of the original problem...

 

I feel better now!

[autowind]

Nice piece of detective work and I hope it's solved the problem.

[Geo]

 

I feel better now!

So do I and it wasn't my problem.

Well done Don, that was a great bit of detective and horological work, I'm well impressed!

[Mark]

Well done mate. You deserve a beer :)

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[DJW]

Well done mate. You deserve a beer :)

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Does a bottle of Napa Valley Cabernet count as well?

[Mark]

That will work ;)

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