New quartz movement, pulses but won't run?

[Apex86]

Greetings!

I was having an issue with a quartz citizen and decided to bypass the issue by replacing the movement.

The hands engage from the crown just fine, the watch pulses on the tester, but the hands won't move.

What could be wrong?

[jdm]

Could be that is defective from factory as it can happen with mass produced products, get a replacement or refund.

[Apex86]

37 minutes ago, jdm said:

Could be that is defective from factory as it can happen with mass produced products, get a replacement or refund.

It could be.

I'm a little curious though, because the movement that came out of it was doing the same thing. Could something happen in the installation process to cause this to occur?

[jdm]

22 minutes ago, Apex86 said:

I'm a little curious though, because the movement that came out of it was doing the same thing. Could something happen in the installation process to cause this to occur?

Quartz mov.t often fails in a mysterious way. You can't see or really diagnose a faulty circuit board, although you can diagnose an interrupted coil. And then you find the part is not available or replaceable. Fortunately Miyota/Citizen are very cheap to replace entirely.

[rodabod]

Are you able to measure the current draw?

[Apex86]

5 minutes ago, rodabod said:

Are you able to measure the current draw?

I'm not sure, I have a generic watch tester (https://www.esslinger.com/watch-battery-and-watch-tester-with-pulse-tester/). Would that allow me to do it?

[jdm]

10 hours ago, Apex86 said:

I'm not sure, I have a generic watch tester (https://www.esslinger.com/watch-battery-and-watch-tester-with-pulse-tester/). Would that allow me to do it?

No, you need a low current multimeter to do that. But it wouldn't help, after you find that it draws the right current, or doesn't, there is still nothing you can do about it. You could have better luck with a line free device, which emits an impulse to free up movn't stuck by dried oil.

[rodabod]

1 hour ago, jdm said:

it wouldn't help, after you find that it draws the right current, or doesn't, there is still nothing you can do about it.

It absolutely can help, because it lets you identify if the train is too heavily loaded which may lead you to identify a fault (hands rubbing being a common example). It also can help to identify if the coil is open-circuit, as the current draw remains lower than expected when running. Looks like the tester has a basic coil test function.

To help free the train if you suspect it is jammed, you can advance one of the wheels at the rotor end of the train gently with an oiler.

I would try un-casing the movement, remove the dial, and just install a seconds hand (if fitted) to check for operation. Also make sure the battery terminal is good and that the insulators are present where they are meant to be.

[jdm]

1 hour ago, rodabod said:

It absolutely can help, because it lets you identify if the train is too heavily loaded which may lead you to identify a fault (hands rubbing being a common example). It also can help to identify if the coil is open-circuit, as the current draw remains lower than expected when running. Looks like the tester has a basic coil test function.

All nice and good things when working on more complex, mov.t which are are difficult to replace, or for which parts are available, etc. But a Miyota/Citizen like the OP has cost typically $5 or less. The tester linked doesn't do anything that an household multimeter can't do, but cost twice as much.

[Apex86]

45 minutes ago, jdm said:

All nice and good things when working on more complex, mov.t which are are difficult to replace, or for which parts are available, etc. But a Miyota/Citizen like the OP has cost typically $5 or less. The tester linked doesn't do anything that an household multimeter can't do, but cost twice as much.

Well, the hands do move freely when operating the crown. I'm not sure if that tells us anything.

I don't have an issue with replacing the movement. I am trying to understand what is happening because the previous movement was doing the same thing and I'm trying to see if anything I did caused this to happen.

If the movement became magnetized, would this be the outcome?

[jdm]

13 minutes ago, Apex86 said:

If the movement became magnetized, would this be the outcome?

No. Quartz mov.t have a lot of magnetism in them already, from the rotor.
And when they fail, or are bad from factory, they won't run. A quite common occurrence in fact.

[rodabod]

2 hours ago, jdm said:

All nice and good things when working on more complex, mov.t which are are difficult to replace, or for which parts are available, etc. But a Miyota/Citizen like the OP has cost typically $5 or less. The tester linked doesn't do anything that an household multimeter can't do, but cost twice as much.

Yes, but your comment was in reply to my suggestion that current draw is a very important measurement. You can't reliably service a quartz watch without one. Otherwise Witschi wouldn't sell any of their testers. It's almost analagous to measuring balance amplitude.

Agree about the point regarding replacing the entire movement, but it may not be the movement itself at fault.

[jdm]

13 minutes ago, rodabod said:

Yes, but your comment was in reply to my suggestion that current draw is a very important measurement. You can't reliably service a quartz watch without one. Otherwise Witschi wouldn't sell any of their testers. It's almost analagous to measuring balance amplitude.

I agree with that. I had been looking for a multimeter capable of measuring µA using low voltage, and the cheapest I could find was about EUR 100. Buying Witschi is out of question for an hobbyist.

[rodabod]

There is some simpler method for current measurement using a multimeter which I can't remember just now. May just involve running a large value resistance in series with the circuit and then measuring the voltage drop across it to determine the current flow. Would rely on the circuit having a very high input impedance though.

[jdm]

4 minutes ago, rodabod said:

There is some simpler method for current measurement using a multimeter which I can't remember just now. May just involve running a large value resistance in series with the circuit and then measuring the voltage drop across it to determine the current flow. Would rely on the circuit having a very high input impedance though.

Correct. But making the fixture to connect to the mov.t leads, plus fitting a resistor, and then do the corrective calculation really exceeds the effort one normally wants to spend on something like that. 

[rodabod]

I'm not sure how much effort it would be for someone who's familiar with soldering. I have access to a Witschi, but if I didn't then I might make a jig. It's what the BHI suggest doing.

Possibly going slightly off topic, but my original point is that measuring current draw is important for serious quartz servicing work. The OP may not consider theirs to be serious work of course.